Procyon

My point is: legality is something flexible. While in Bolivia having a garden on coke is quite OK, you know how it's in the rest of the world. I never said in this topic I was rightful, that's why I don't accept comments like Rotwang's. I close my arguments here. When hipocrisy enters the room, common sense leaves thru the back door.

First, I rip mp3s. But I am sure, despite not knowing them, that a lot of videogame fans do rip and download files, instead of buying them. The same for e-books, movies etc... Is is stealing? yes, it is. Is it legal? In some cases it is. Most, not. Closer to the psy scene: a lot of artists have an illegal version of programs running on their computers? Yes, a lot. Do they use illegal samples? Yes, a lot. Do they remix unauthorized tracks? Yes, they do. Do they use, say, tribal chants and do not pay the royalties to the singers? Yes, they do. And do they want to sell their work legally and get mad at people file-sharing their work? Yes, some of them. The smarter ones are not that "decent" and even release their tracks for free. Another dirty corner of this ring is: "it's illegal to download mp3s, you indecent"...wait a moment while I take my illegal drug (that costs lives in the places where they are harvested, and their profits are used by some to sponsor terror, which takes the lives of thousands every year) You see, it's not a perfect world. Legality is a word with many meanings. What is completely illegal for me, may be OK for you. And vice-versa. So, don't judge my actings if yours are not that good. By the way, I am not writing about you, ORMION, but the psychedelic trancers as a whole. As for the drug thing, I don't know any clean guy in this scene. Hell, I know some guys who rise the "Buy Legal Psy Albums" placard while taking ecstasy in the backstage. Call it hipocrisy!

@richpa, I retreat the first lines: I reread your MQ comment and understood you didn't take this personally. My mistake.

I think these last two pages are a wonderful example of hipocrisy, and dumbness, IMO. I took part in another thread in another forum about the use of samples in some tracks that are never asked permission from the original author. Or the remixes of a whole work, whose author never guesses this happened to his work. And these samples and remixes make into CDs and payable mp3s that - supposedly - will make some rightful earning to the parts interested. So, I think it's not fair the preaching some said here, while other aspects of the situation are not cleared. I am not saying that one error justifies another. But it's hipocrisy what I read here, like "people I know are decent", meaning, "you are not". Wow! If you want to be an example of decency then help clean the dirty corners of this scene before calling other people indecent. As for dumbness, I take the example of a model of business that is not working well at all for more than a decade, even for the giants - and the refusal of recognizing that the model is failing and another refusal in adapting to what is really going on. I am honest enough - and also lacking decency according to Rotwang - to admit that I am not spending my money on payable tracks and instead ripping them from mp4 files. Well, I live in the real world, where this happens a lot. I will not pretend I don't that, because then I would be lying. And most people I know do that, be my rich boss or my friends. This is the world where money is spent, not the Wonderland some of the preachers live. To the ones who haven't read, I will make it clearer: most releases are not worthy buying, so I don't buy it. But if it's downloadable, I will do that, no blinks. Want me to buy an album? Then make it good. In the end I hope this whole discussion helps not only improving the quality of the writing of goa and psy works, but also the way these works are sold. Wait! Who is selling psy and goa these days?

Hmm? You are a little confused, it was you who said I was turning on you, NOT ON YOUR BUSINESS. So you took this personally. But it does not matter to me. I made my point: the world is not completely according to your, as a manager, point of view. Anyway, I wish your business success. Ok, you and your friends are decent. Be proud of that. I didn't say it was OK, I just said that it happens more than we wished.

Sorry, but the Multiquote button is not working with me. First, Richpa, do not take this personally. I am not trying to destroy your business, as I see you are taking this. I am just stating what is happening currently. Also, unfortunately what I wrote (DJs ripping MP3s out of MP4 files), it is true and I am a witness to that. Again, as for the quality of ripped MP3, I suggest you do this with one Liquid Flow track from Youtube. It's perfect. Technologies have improved a lot. You know that. Last, I see you think I - and others like me, who are frank about the current psy/goa market - dream of seeing you going bankrupt . For Krishna's sake! I wish you and your label do great. Certainly there are people willing to pay for downloads and CDs, you have faithful customers and I wish you have more and more. What I am saying is that I WAS ONE who used to buy CDs and pay for MP3s, and why I don't do that anymore. That's it!

Well, this is your opinion, a very particular one, as a label manager. This does not apply to users. I certainly don't see this situation this way.

Yes. But are you going to be frank enough to admit this is true, it happens to almost every music artist, and most people you know do this exactly as I described?

Keep doing it if this is what floats your boat. I still do some backdrops, for the passion of it. I am not saying that you, and other established labels are useless, as you are taking it. What I mean is that to most people, what you do is invisible, unfortunately. Take what I say as a voice of millions: who care about coverart these days, for instance? Long gone are the times people felt pleasure reading the name of the authors, the studio name, etc...I surely don't care about names anymore. It belongs to a time when CDs ruled. This MP3 generation cares only about download speed and size. And rare are the ones who like me, care about the quality of the music. As for sound quality, when your rip MP3 out of MP4, you have a lot of programs doing it with Hi-Q available. I am honest to say that I ripped all Liquid Flow tracks from Youtube, and it sounds crystaline.

Why not? Only 1MB MP3 files would make it as a release? The only instance where I don't see a Soundcloud/YT track not as a release, is when only part of the track can be listen - say, the first 2 minutes. And it's not ready to be dwld. That is an appetizer, IMO. Not a release.

This happened to Chi-ad in 2006: someone made his whole album available before he could, himself, release it. Which was just a protocol, I think. For, in the end his album would sell only some tens of copies and the whole of his fans would get it via MP3. He, or someone else, would eventually make the whole album downloadable. And what really matters in this example? Nothing, IMO. What I really cared about was his tracks, not the way it was "released".

I don't agree about the formats. Again take me as an example: I don't care if SIAM releases his next track via a small goa label, or via a giant like Sony. In the end, I won't buy it, I will download it from somewhere. Why? Because that's how it works nowadays. So, to me - and to millions - it does not matter if it was officially released or not, as long as it's downloadable from somewhere. And to me, it was released, because I got it, I can listen to it, I can DJ it. Add to this formula, the poor writing problem - which is the very reason of this thread - and you see people like me refusing to spend their money on something they probably won't like. All this make Youtube, Soundcloud and the likes, Ektoplazm the best option for getting a track. I don't buy CDs anymore. This is a trend, the market is so online now that even the recent blu-ray is said to last no more than five years. It is the end of the music industry as we knew it: artist writes/label releases. I think what works now is: artist writes/uploads somewhere. His work won't sell anyway, but he may get known, and cash from another source other than selling albums: bookings, for instance. The only money I will spend on an artist this year is Astral Projection's next album. Hating or loving their next work, it is a must-have for me. Honestly, if I liked, say, what Artifakt 303 did, I would donwload it from Youtube, would not spend my money on buying his album.

And by which parameters a Best of my youtube tracks can not be taken as a release? AFA the artist made it public, it is a release. It does not matter if it was via Ektoplazm, a homepage, Sony site or Youtube. To be honest, most of the tracks I have are from Youtube or Ektoplazm - to me the two best sources when we are talking about releases. YT has become sort of a huge CD store, where you can find tens of releases everyday, of every possible genre. EDIT: technically, when an artist makes his track public via Youtube he is aware, or not, that it is downloadable - so it's a release, anyway. Soundcloud too, when he enables his work to be downloaded, it's a release. Technology has made the boundaries very subtle, thin, sometimes inexistent.

:lol: :lol: Man, I don't know why, but when I read your post the movie "200 Cigarettes" came to my mind. I guess it's because this 'dirtiness' was so nice some years ago.

Surely you are his friend.

That is why people like him don't have many friends: raw, crude sincerity hurts a lot. Where did I read that this world is made of small lies?

Yes, you are right. However, this is a hypocrit world, don't you know that? We are far from being intelligent, nice and understanding to one another. Lairs was in an event where millions of dollars run in the backstage. His films must cost millions of dollars to be done. He needs sponsors and all the backing from the film industry. And guess what, there are a lot of hypocrit people sponsoring his films. He should have let his personal jokes at home, with his friends. His innocent joke very likely will cost his career. I doubt he will ever get financial help from US agents, or will have his films screened in US soil. I just read that Argentina has already vetoed "Melancholy". FYI, I am one who believe the world would do better without Israel. But I surely won't express that in a business conference, or - closer to our trance world - in a gig where all the israeli psy producers would play along me. I think the operative word here is "diplomacy", that's how we deal with our differences and avoid wars. EDIT: I forgot your mentioning on Muslins and Christians. It's OK to joke about them the same way it's OK to joke about Israel. But, again, there are places where you could tell them, and places where you couldn't.

IMO, Lars was simply naive. You may wish the whole Israel to be abducted by an UFO and disappear forever somewhere in deep space, but you don't joke about Jews in front of microphones and cameras.

Oh! When I click on MQ button, nothing happens. It started to happen some two months ago. The Reply one works fine. Here's the message I get when I log in: [#10193] We encountered a problem processing your login request. Please try again. I use two Macs, both Safari 5.0.5.

You should stay, every one of us has an unique point of view. That's why forums exist: a place where we can see, and learn, when we meet. But then, there are some subjects that are present in psychedelic trance, but we should be very careful when mixing - say - sex and psy trance in the same conversation. The same for politics, religion, drugs. And as someone said above, don't feel offended by us. Offense and negativism are the blood of any forum

Off topic: Err... multiquote button does not work with me. Also, everytime I log in, an "Error Occurred" message appears. But then I clickon "forums", and I am redirected to, voila' , here.

Yes, but before that he released his tracks, 4 or 5, via Youtube. And he was quite successful, I first heard about him, there. A lot of hits per video, great comments. What I meant, is that besides the numbers you showed, there are many other neogoa releases that are under the radar.

Do you know if Youtube Records releases are in these numbers? I take, say, Siam as an example of an artist that releases his tracks on youtube, only.

A little off-topic, but culturally interesting: Elysium has a point in associating the word NEO with the nazis. During WW2, the so called Neuordnung (new order), was part of the ocupation policy. Also interesting is that the legendary British band - I recommend the Technique album for those who don't know them - took their name from the German word. But they were never associated with the Nazi. I think Elysium somehow, unconsciously, associated the word NEO with the nazis - he must have read this somewhere.

IMO, it's art, handmade, so price is OK. Art is art. Period. That mask will sell in days. If they have a Japanese text, I bet 8 out 10 will go to Japan. Even after the things that went on there, parties are a mix of flea market and dance floor. Twisted could also build a line of clothing and deco, like spacetribe.com did. I have bought some stuff from them, very nice.