Guest Rain Posted March 11, 2005 Share Posted March 11, 2005 ok... I need some explanations here... Reading all those reviews and topics I see people writing the word 'cheezy' as a mark an element of a goa artist... still I notice that there are like two different defenitions of 'cheezy' 1) cheezy psy trance is psytrance that's made to sell... trance that's made with the perspective that lots of people will like it & buy it, the so called killar albums... 2) cheezy is the very melodic and uplifting psy trance that has a lot of emotions and intens feelings... that you wanna cry ... like yahel, lani, vibe tribe, muses rapt etc... my question is... lots of people call like lani or yahel songs cheezy because lots of people like it because it touches you in a very special place.... but that doens't mean those goa artist made their music with the persepective to sell a lot of stuff and have lots of fans... they just made the goa they liked or wanted to make... there's a rare paradox I believe and would like to know your opinion... still this is not a pro or against cheezy psytrance topic or what is cheezy for examples and then bash the artist... I'm looking for a way to put 'cheezy' into a perspective and create some generality (not neccessarily off course )... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmithabaBuddha Posted March 11, 2005 Share Posted March 11, 2005 ok... I need some explanations here... Reading all those reviews and topics I see people writing the word 'cheezy' as a mark an element of a goa artist... still I notice that there are like two different defenitions of 'cheezy' 1) cheezy psy trance is psytrance that's made to sell... trance that's made with the perspective that lots of people will like it & buy it, the so called killar albums... 2) cheezy is the very melodic and uplifting psy trance that has a lot of emotions and intens feelings... that you wanna cry ... like yahel, lani, vibe tribe, muses rapt etc... my question is... lots of people call like lani or yahel songs cheezy because lots of people like it because it touches you in a very special place.... but that doens't mean those goa artist made their music with the persepective to sell a lot of stuff and have lots of fans... they just made the goa they liked or wanted to make... there's a rare paradox I believe and would like to know your opinion... still this is not a pro or against cheezy psytrance topic or what is cheezy for examples and then bash the artist... I'm looking for a way to put 'cheezy' into a perspective and create some generality (not neccessarily off course )... 228497[/snapback] well nitzonot is cheezy and doesnt make me cry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinos Posted March 11, 2005 Share Posted March 11, 2005 Cheesy is music that's uninspired and lacks production skills. Nothing more. well nitzonot is cheezy and doesnt make me cry 228499[/snapback] It sure makes me cry out loud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benf52 Posted March 11, 2005 Share Posted March 11, 2005 for me cheezy has little to do with selling albums... there were many good goa bands that made cheezy tracks imo, but still it doesn't mean it is in the goal of selling albums... and it is not touching either.. i mean the whole point about intense feelings is a very subjective thing... i get intense feeling in psy when i listen to groovy and psychedelic tracks.... for me cheezy is fluffy melodies, ususally i have to skip the track as soon as those melodies show up, like in many AP tracks, or yahel, or many others... it just really turns me off... but i understand some people like it so that's cool... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemmiwinks Posted March 11, 2005 Share Posted March 11, 2005 my question is... lots of people call like lani or yahel songs cheezy because lots of people like it because it touches you in a very special place.... but that doens't mean those goa artist made their music with the persepective to sell a lot of stuff and have lots of fans... they just made the goa they liked or wanted to make... hmm... good point there Rain. Also one can argue that the cheeziest music of them all is progressive because it sounds EXACTLY like music you'd hear in clubs (what could sell better than music played in mainstream clubs?) whereas Yahel and Lani even if they have catchy melodies would never be played in "normal" clubs. Yet progressive doesn't have a hint of melodies in it... Anyway to go back to what you said, I guess it's all a matter of perspective. For me it has become a habit of calling catchy melodies "cheeze" even if I like them and they touch me in a special way. I guess that the problem is once artists take those elements and use JUST those elements (like the transition of "normal trance" to eurotrance or the early 90s eurodance to the crappy kiddie-like pop like Aqua or the transition of happy hardcore to kiddie music). Well, basically once it's music for kids it ain't good anymore... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuff Posted March 11, 2005 Share Posted March 11, 2005 Cheesy melodies is for me those easy, childish, 3-4 chords melodies with obvious note changes made so predictable and boring. It's everywhere (also in psy of course) but mostly in the 'commerical trance'/'hardhouse'...business and other chart-music. Where they too often are following basic melodic standards, with no intentions what so ever in doing complex (yes - more time consuming) hard melodic work. But I really do love melodies when it keeps on evolving (best cases over more than 4 bars and unpredictable notes keeps on floating and following each other. When i clearly can hear that it takes talent to do and there has been some hard work to create it then it's also a joy for the ear to listen to. Much good old goa melodies has this capability, like some lead moments (that maybe ben consider cheesy Shakta "Lepton Head", Crop Circles "Lunar Civilization", Chi-A.D. "Eye Am The I", Pleiadians "Maia", Etnica "Vimana", Astral Projection & Dado "Zero", A.P. "Mahadeva" in example. & It doesn't has to be catchy like the obvious "Mahadeva", Cosmosis "Gift of the Gods" and Jaïa "Maï Maï", less "hit potential" melodies like MFG "Magnetic Activity" and Ra "Paradox" also does the job extraordinary well . And yes, 'less intense' melodies with fewer notes & changes like Astral P "Liquid Sun" and Power Source "Goaway" for instance, are also outstanding when it's done in the right way. Small subtle changes in different parts of the melody that may not occur in your face the first time you hear it, but when catching up with the pattern it's just beautiful. But i hate really -obvious/in your face/on the top- melodies when they are so completely LAME done! Thats when i start to use phrases like cheesy. If there's gonna be a BIG, HUGE fucking melody right in the face please at least listen to "Bust A Move" by IM first, should give some point of reference & no one can say and mean that they haven't put some effort in it... Asura "Fahrenheit", is another example of a lead melody that does the unpredictable - when theres long drawn out notes that does what a loop can't do. Maybe the loop in question can make you imagine that stuff happening, but it feels too far away and impossible to make come true because it's too complex to realize. ;-D I also like what Infected Mushroom managed to do on the "Classical" album. It is no piece of cake to do some of their lead melodies there. "Dracul" for example, where the notes doesn't fall on every 16th note, it adds a unique dramatic touch when they keep on attacking and stutters into different rhytmical and melodic patterns. Thats where i connect to masterpieces on melodies like JS Bach. Though I.M. may not have his capability, they showed that they can create beeaaautifully well done melodies and won't always settle down with the normal, way easier, quickly done and basic melodic structures. And it also feels good when someone really tries to do a melody that haven't been heard before. Or not always will settle down with someting that anyone easily can copy. Maybe 'uniqueness' is a good summarizing word of a really good melody¿ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frontier Psychiatrist Posted March 11, 2005 Share Posted March 11, 2005 Yet progressive doesn't have a hint of melodies in it... 228509[/snapback] Now, that's totally wrong man... Freq, Ticon, Son Kite and BLT are definately progressive artists with a lot of melodic presence in their music. And it's mostly less cheezy than your average morning full-on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zewu Posted March 12, 2005 Share Posted March 12, 2005 Some people seem to call New Kind of World with MFG cheezy........but I just love those twisting, melodic samples with their calls and responses! Cheezy or not, MFG are great!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Time_Trap Posted March 12, 2005 Share Posted March 12, 2005 Some people seem to call New Kind of World with MFG cheezy........but I just love those twisting, melodic samples with their calls and responses! Cheezy or not, MFG are great!!!!!! 228597[/snapback] tell these ppl to get a new pair of ears If MFG are cheezy, then what is holymen ? btw, imo their best albums are Project Genesis and The Prophecy, although i like all of their work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zewu Posted March 12, 2005 Share Posted March 12, 2005 tell these ppl to get a new pair of ears If MFG are cheezy, then what is holymen ? btw, imo their best albums are Project Genesis and The Prophecy, although i like all of their work. 228660[/snapback] I think all of their albums are great as well as their their tracks on compilations and EP's. The Prophecy, New kind of World and Project Genesis are very, very, very good while The Message is not quite as good but still really good. Perhaps I will grow into The Message later on. I can still understand people calling MFG cheezy though, and I would have to say New Kind of World would be their cheeziest album. But I don't think they are very cheezy after all. They are my favourite goa/trance group anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherlockalien Posted March 12, 2005 Share Posted March 12, 2005 WHAT? prog music is not melodic? man you´ve just been listening to the wrong stuff, or you need to clean your ears cheesy? Well cheesy I understand in terms of ´romantic´.... Not that the music talks about love necessarily, but there is this ´oh I love you´, or ´plur´ vibe in a melodie or sample/vocals... not all cheese is bad though... there are ugly and smelly french cheeses, and some good and effective muzzarella or cottage cheases Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manuser Posted March 12, 2005 Share Posted March 12, 2005 not all cheese is bad though... there are ugly and smelly french cheeses, and some good and effective muzzarella or cottage cheases 228717[/snapback] like new age music this music with piano, melodic layers, i like some of it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rain Posted March 12, 2005 Share Posted March 12, 2005 well lots of different opions here like I expected ... I like cheezy... or I don't, I don't care how people define the music I like, If I like it, I like it... but in the review section I'm sometimes thinking what do they mean with cheezy, that's why this topic... conclusion: the word cheezy has got no interpretation level for me... I will ignore it cause there is no general definiton, what is fine to me, no problem just checking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basilisk Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 one can argue that the cheeziest music of them all is progressive because it sounds EXACTLY like music you'd hear in clubs (what could sell better than music played in mainstream clubs?) whereas Yahel and Lani even if they have catchy melodies would never be played in "normal" clubs. Yet progressive doesn't have a hint of melodies in it... 228509[/snapback] What the fuck are you on about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rain Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 What the fuck are you on about 228969[/snapback] he's right if you look at my first definiton of cheezy progressiv trance is the trance that's most similar to regular trance especially with those new housy influences lately... he's theory is not that strange... but you see again this examples proofes that the definiton of cheezy is not general but indivdual... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auryn Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 to me the essence of cheesy is when you know what they (the artist(s)) are trying to do, but you're not buying it because it's too obvious. in trance this usually applies to melodic "emotional" climaxes for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rain Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 in trance this usually applies to melodic "emotional" climaxes for me 229287[/snapback] what is the second defnition of cheezy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seraph Posted March 15, 2005 Share Posted March 15, 2005 Cheesy melodies is for me those easy, childish, 3-4 chords melodies with obvious note changes made so predictable and boring. It's everywhere (also in psy of course) but mostly in the 'commerical trance'/'hardhouse'...business and other chart-music. Where they too often are following basic melodic standards, with no intentions what so ever in doing complex (yes - more time consuming) hard melodic work. But I really do love melodies when it keeps on evolving (best cases over more than 4 bars and unpredictable notes keeps on floating and following each other. When i clearly can hear that it takes talent to do and there has been some hard work to create it then it's also a joy for the ear to listen to. Much good old goa melodies has this capability, like some lead moments (that maybe ben consider cheesy Shakta "Lepton Head", Crop Circles "Lunar Civilization", Chi-A.D. "Eye Am The I", Pleiadians "Maia", Etnica "Vimana", Astral Projection & Dado "Zero", A.P. "Mahadeva" in example. & It doesn't has to be catchy like the obvious "Mahadeva", Cosmosis "Gift of the Gods" and Jaïa "Maï Maï", less "hit potential" melodies like MFG "Magnetic Activity" and Ra "Paradox" also does the job extraordinary well . And yes, 'less intense' melodies with fewer notes & changes like Astral P "Liquid Sun" and Power Source "Goaway" for instance, are also outstanding when it's done in the right way. Small subtle changes in different parts of the melody that may not occur in your face the first time you hear it, but when catching up with the pattern it's just beautiful. 228553[/snapback] Stuff, you are absolutely right about it, I agree 100 % and I hate someone calling spiritual melodies cheesy, I find it mean and evil, not a matter of taste, but a metter of hatered... And it is mostly proclaimed that is cheesy by kids that are obsessed with dark, evil trance that is so 'cool'....Hahahah... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuff Posted March 15, 2005 Share Posted March 15, 2005 Thanks! SPIRITUALITY was the word i searched for. Together with uniqueness - there's no cheeze in sight. ; ) Although a melody does not really have to be that unique to reach spiritual heights...or? Nevermind, spiritual melodies aren't cheesy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rain Posted March 15, 2005 Share Posted March 15, 2005 Well I don't like the fact either when they call super melodic and touchy psy sounds 'cheezy' because they don't like it... that's why the topic... I sometimes disturb msyelf when people call some music cheezy because it's intens melodic so spiritual isn't cheezy at all to me imho... it' just a way to create psytrance just like dark trance... so why call it cheezy ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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