Mp3

[Guest bugbread]

Once again, I'm not taking a position either way, just pointing out incorrect arguments when they pop up, so:

 

Llazi:

am convinced (taking myself as a example) that without internet/mp3 the psy scene would be very small compared to todays scene

 

That may be true in certain areas, but is not a universal truth. In Japan, there is extremely little mp3 swapping (mainly because the only P2P software in Japanese is WinMX, and the only people who use WinMX that I know of use it for J-pop. To put it in perspective, lots of people at work use it do download pop, but I don't know a single Japanese psy listener who downloads MP3s). However, the scene is huge.

 

Mp3s are one way a scene can be big. A popular musician supporting a genre is another way. Bad / good luck is another way. So your argument isn't necessarily always WRONG, but neither is it particularly RIGHT.

 

-bug

 

(Ok, random anecdote time)

 

Wanna know why psy is big in Japan? You'll hate this, I swear, but I'm convinced it's the truth.

 

About 2 or 3 years ago, there was a big Epic Trance (System F, Tiesto) boom. Fine by me, because I love them. Anyway, on most of the fliers, it would just say something like "trance party". Well, for psy parties, the fliers would also say "trance party". Then Hamasaki Ayumi (The Japanese equivalent of Brittney Spears) started using techno-like stuff in her songs and getting remixed by proper techno artists, so all the teeny-boppers got into trance and started going to trance parties. Well, at the start, every once in a while, you'd see these kids who thought they were going to an epic trance party show up in a psy party, looking dazed and confused. But, as unfortunately is often the case, if there were drugs available, they'd get fucked up and have a grand old time, despite their lack of interest in the music. After a while, some of them started to come to like psy as well, so all the teeny boppers started coming to the psy parties and getting drunk and in fights and picking up on eachother. And so psy became popular in Japan, with nary an mp3 in sight.

 

So Japan is popular in Japan because of confusing genre names. Yippee.

[Guest Quazar]

People buy an artist cd-» label makes money-» artist makes money-» artist gets happy, not just for the fact that he earns money, but also for knowing that people respect him, support him and love him-» gets happy, therefore gets more open minded-» more open minded, makes better music-» better music means better parties-» best parties, happier people get.

 

 

....or is that to complicated to understand.

 

 

Peace.

[Guest Lightmatch]

i see that all of u keep flaming the mp3 scene. i dont care. and for elysium:

I STILL GET MY 2 and not 1 but 2 GB of 320kbps music each day dude.

problem is u dont understand all of us got illegal mp3's and play them at parties. even big names. wriete whatever u like here and even ban my ip i dont give a shit. i come here just to see the names of new cd's and laugh with people like elysium and their fake high position.

 

don't write above this line

 

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[Guest Elysium Project]

it's called laught at my friend!

[Guest bugbread]

Lightmatch:

 

the mp3 scene

 

Um...mp3 is just a file format. There is no mp3 "scene", any more than there is a "jpg scene" or "gif scene". I'll assume you mean "mp3 trading scene", and, since the point of this whole thread is trading of copyrighted mp3s, the "bootleg mp3 trading scene".

 

Just sounds weird hearing people talk about the "mp3 scene".

 

That, and, please, Lightmatch, grow up. I have downloaded mp3s before. I have bought some albums based on them. I have erased some because I didn't like them. And, heresy of heresy, I have kept some without paying for the album! But that doesn't mean I go bragging to everyone about how much of a thief I am.

 

problem is u dont understand all of us got illegal mp3's and play them at parties

 

No, I'm pretty sure he understands that.

 

wriete whatever u like here and even ban my ip i dont give a shit

 

Ok, that's good to know.

 

i come here just to see the names of new cd's and laugh with people like elysium and their fake high position

 

Um, laugh at them for what?

[Guest v4K]

right on lightmatch! thats the TRUE goa spirit!!!

now go out to the street and teach other young kids about the REAL psy scene boy!!!

 

...fuckin poser

v4K

[Guest h]

if artists want us to buy their albums they should make them cheaper.

In greece where i live all psytrance cd's cost about 25euros and the ticket to a party in athens is about 30euro.

Do you think that we can pay every week so much money for cd's that might be crap or for parties that the dj's never come? If artists respected us we would respect them too. And i think that the labels that got bankrupt must have gone not because of mp3 but because the owners spent all their money on coce or something

[Guest Elysium Project]

"if artists want us to buy their albums they should make them cheaper"

 

Wake up! The artists do NOT deside how much a CD cost?

 

About DJ´s not showing up at parties in Greece I can only say this:

 

It's not the DJ's but the many malaka promoters that use the DJ´s names to attract people without even asking the DJ to play!

 

It's happened more than 10 times for me in Greece. That was one of teh reasons why I stoped playing in Greece and becasue I always had to fight to get my money.

It seem to me h that you got zero respect for anybody but yourself!

 

By the way you blaim the label mangers of being coke heads. I have never seen so many heroin addicted people as in Greek parties!

[Guest Firestorm]

damn, I only hear bad things about Greek people........it can't be THAT bad?

(how about the Greek ladies? hehehe)

 

 

 

ps: mp3 sucks

[Guest Elysium Project]

No firestorm it's not......I personally have very nice Greek friends that always have been welcoming me with open arms... It just seem that some from the younger generation are the ones with a BIG attitude problem. Just see the few in this forum that get very agressive and start to post immature posts when someone do not agree with them.

 

The greek girls are beautiful but 75% are broad up thinking that they need a rich man (so they dont have to work) and that everybody else are loosers. That's why you see so many stunningly beautiful women married to ugly small fat malakas.

 

The remaining 25% Greek women/girls are also very reserved until you get to know them :-)...Once you know them they are the best girlfriends in the world :-)

[Guest Lightmatch]

Elysium Project fuck off and fuck your mother. U are a heroin addicted asshole. We hate drugs and assholes like u next time u come to a party here i come too with 30 friends and FUCK YO ASS.

[Guest cpt_shiner]

just thought i would post this from an aussie forum.. if your wondering if it does indeed hurt the artists.. franny from demon tea talking about the sales of Loopus in Fabula's new album and Demon Tea sales in general, everyone has been sayin how its the best thing since sliced bread but ppl arnt supporting them, shame, shame, shame....

 

"Wirikuta sold 140 copies last I checked!!!!

Terrible response! I think this is good evidence

that copying rally does hurt artists, the amount of reviews that it got, and the amount of people on lists

that ere talkign about were alot more than that!

Maybe 200-300 copies sold all up

 

The tracklisting on teh inside is correct

 

love, franny

 

I see that many people want demon tea, but would rather spend their moeny on the latest hot

TIP offering etc, and can wait a for a copyed version

]of demon tea, becuase its flavur doesnt fade so quickly as most fashion releases do ......

and once they get a copy, no way are they going to spend there money on a release that they allreayd have heard / have.

 

It actually shits me no end to see how many people

claim that they cant spend their money on cds, as they dont have enough, but then you see them at every other party dropping 2 or 3 pills or other drugs......

shitty support, and this copying crap happens everywhere, I have seen MANY MANY copyed versions

of Demon tea around North NSW and South E Qld

all at peopels places that could EASILY AFFORD to pay for them........... oh well, I dont do it fo rthe money,

its an art project...... i dont care if i dont sell any copies"

[Guest Tomer]

oh my, people relax...

 

Frankly, to be quite honest with you, i do download full albums on mp3. I do this because most of the music released im not really fond of, and i have no way of telling whether or not I enjoy the music before listening to it. And psyshop.org and there 96kbps 48 seconds doesn't tell me anything about the tunes.. For example, the album Vibraspirit 23, from many many psychadelic trance boards, people were talking about how its the album of the year, so i downloaded it listend to it, and i didn't like it one bit. And, im extatic that i didn't go out and pay for it. However, the Alien Project album, i downloaded listend to it, there were enough tracks on it I liked that i wanted to own the album.. So i bought it.. Same goes for the likes of infected mushroom, Cosma, Lish, Twisted sessions, Unusuall suspects, and more.. Those are examples of albums i first downloaded and the bought.. Frankly if there haden't been file sharing i would not know anything about alot of music genres. but since there is an mp3 file sharing community it gives me a chance to listen to and see if i enjoyed the music. Hell, if i bought all the albums i wanted to 90% of them i would HATE and i would be in debt alot alot of money..

 

 

Support a community that uses the mp3 trading scene for good, if you like something buy it, but i don't support a community that expects me to buy there cd before i know if i like it.. Because there is a greater chance that i won't like your music..

[Guest Elysium Project]

That's good Tomer but do you get rid of the mp3 albums you don't like after you have decided not to buy them or do you keep them on a burned Disc just in case you like to listen to them off and on? - Isen't that the real issue here?

[Guest Tomer]

well, actually that vibraspirit 23 i deleted.. But thats not the issue, the real issue is that there is so much out there, so much to listen to..

 

how am i supposed to know what to buy?

 

I live in Toronto Canada, you know it cost $40.00 to buy that unusual suspects album, $25.00 for that cosma album. If i haden't listend to that album first, payed $40.00 for it, then found out i hated it, that would be the last album i would EVER buy. Hell, if there was no mp3 i wouldn't buy music and i wouldn't have favourite artists to support..

 

The real problem is the fact that there are so many people drownding the music community with so much stuff, that there's too much to go through to find out what you like and what you don't..

 

so all the artists bitching about mp3s, the only reason you got my money, about $40.00 an album because its imported to Canada, is because of the mp3s.. the only reason i come to see you live and give you my money again, is because of the mp3s..

 

and from what i understands most artists make the bulk of there money doing live performance not from album sales, and that was true even before the start of mp3 trading community..

[Guest Elysium Project]

Come on Tomer those are so old and boring excuses for downloading.

 

You say that all artist make loads of money from live gigs. How do you know that? I for one do not play live anymore (my own desision) and I know that it's only the top-notch 10 - 15% of the bands that make a living out of it.

 

And what about all the canceleled gigs and the gigs where the promoters run away with the money? I can also tell ,you that an esteimated normal salery for a live gig is around $. 2000 - 3000 before tax and this has to be shared with how many memebers there are in the band. Not much is left after that! It's only the major bands that get more for playing live!

 

It's also very expensive to buy CD's here in Denmark...Does that make it ok to steal the music?...NO.

 

It's not an excuse that becasue there's so much music "drowning" the music community you have to download it!

 

The artist do not get $. 40.00 we get about 14-20% of $. 8.00 - 10.00 (the price that the labels sell the CD for to the distributor) after deduction of all costs!

 

I know for a fact that many artists made much more money from record sales befor the mp3 "revolution" began!

 

In the end Tomer it's not your business how much we artists make from our sales or not....just keep your long fingers away from our music. What would you say if I started to tell you that you make too much money from your work and that I am going to steal the product that you produce just because I like to. Would you like that?

[Guest v4K]

I'm bored of this topic already, It's useles to speak to people that can't understand what theyr figthing for... I'm talkin about the MP3 guys... get a life, learn about the goa spirit and PLUR

 

...and then fuck off thill you get over 20 (...hopeing you guys mature soon)

v4K

[Guest Tomer]

go for it..

 

you know what, my friend, i still believe that if you were going to buy it then you will still buy it if not then you won't. and if all your music means to you is money, then it probably sucks anyways and i probably won't like it..

 

if the dollar signs are the only thing that drives you to make music then tell me what you make and ill make a point of a) not downloading it, and deffanitly not buying it..

 

I only buy what i enjoy, and i think yes the fact that there is so much out there does give me a good excuse to download music.. Your asking me to buy something without trying it first. its like me walking in to a car dealership a guy telling me oh this is a great car trust me, i've never heard of it before, i drive it home fucking thing breaks down but i can't return it..

 

I refuse to buy music i can't listen to first, and like i said i do buy all the stuff i like after listening to it once on mp3, and frankly i still think its overpriced. And wah wah wah the record companies get all your money, then maybe its time you figured out another way to market yourself...

 

do it because you love, not because you want the money.. AND SUPPORT THE ARTISTS THAT YOU LIKE.. thats what i do.. and if me listening first to mp3s then buying the music is still not good enough for you, if according to you i should BLINDLEY throw my money at artists wich most don't even care, THEN FUCK THAT, why don't i just stop buying and listening to music all together, if all they care about is money, then there not getting mine..!!!!! and again to let you know, i order about an album a week, and to you its booo fucking hoo i spend $40.00 on YOUR FUCKING MUSIC!

then BOO FUCKING HOOO PEOPLE DOWNLOAD YOUR MUSIC.. IF YOU DON"T FUCKING CARE, THEN I DON"T FUCKING CARe.. And for your IGNORANT information, i DON"T go to movies, because its outragiously overpriced, I REFUCSE to pay $12.50 to see a movie.. BUT FUCK! AT LEAST THEY GIVE YOU PREVIOUSE ON TV SO YOU GET AN IDEA OF WHAT YOUR GETTING!! and they don't charge $40.00 a movie, and frankly i don't think actors desserve to make more then doctors.. Quit being so ignorant and jaded i buy music because i love a certain artist, if that artist came up to me and said fuck you you first listend to my shit on mp3, the FUCK HIM.. Im not giving my blind faith to anyone in this world..

ok, im done ranting..

 

SUPPORT THE ARTISTS YOU LOVE..

FUCK THE GREED MONGERS..

And i FULLY support mp3 trading for preview listening.. BECAUSE MOST ARTIST don't put there heart into the music and therefore it sucks!!!!

[Guest Tomer]

i appologise for ranting, and for all the cursing i did..

 

 

I just think the only way the music community can survive is by using mp3 for its own success, instead your all so afraid you use it to your dimise.. i have friends who make music, and owe all there success to the mp3 community..

 

I think both can survive together in harmoney..

 

Both sides need to quit being so greedy.. the labels have to stop leeching off there artists becoming millionaires, and the artists have to stop thinking they desserve to be the ricchest people on the planet because they make music..

 

as well, the consumer has to stop being so greedy that they want everything for free..

 

download, listen, preview, enjoy, then buy..

 

if you don't enjoy it, then get rid of it and don't buy it..

 

again im sorry for the ranting and all the cursing in the post above..

[Guest Elysium Project]

Greedy? You really do not know what you're talking about do you? The only greedy people I see are the people downloading gig's after gig's of mp3's.

 

There's no way that we can live with a mp3 "mafia"....

 

Let me tell you a little story so you might wake up (I doubt it though but at least I tried).

 

I invested nearly $. 13,000 (leasing) in a studio 1 and a half year ago. It took me quite some time (3-4 months) to get into the studio (technical side of it) and to start my production. After that I worked hard in my studio for 7-8 months finishing my soon to be released CD (2 weeks from now :-)).

 

All in all it has costed me (leasing rates and fees) so far more than $. 6,000. I got 3,000 in advance for the CD. That mean that I have MINUS $. 3,000 right now. I seriously doubt I will see any royalties (due to the fact that most peopel will copy the music and download it) and I will properly sell mac. 1,000 copies. So tell me does that strike you as being greedy? I anticipate to break even within a year (maybe a bit longer) and then if I am lucky there will be a scene left for me to release in!

 

Stop speaking about things you don't know the first thing about Tomer.... I know you're not a bad person but you seem to go as far as possible to defend your stealing!

[Guest Tomer]

i don't deffend stealing, i go as far as possible to deffend the fact that i am %100 in favour of previewing music before buying them..

 

I am not in favour of just having mp3s and not buying and supporting artists you like..

 

 

and to be honest with you, i might end up downloading your album, and if i like it I will buy it, and if i don't ill delete the mp3s, same as i do for everyone..

 

thats what im deffending

[Guest Elysium Project]

Well that I have no problem with Tomer but the problem was that I asked you if you delete the mp3 CD's you download and don't buy and frankly you never answered that question properly which made me suspicious that you keep them too (I am still not convinced that you delete them). Another thing that makes me see "red" is the way you seem to know so much about artists and the way they think and live their lives. You say:

 

"And i FULLY support mp3 trading for preview listening.. BECAUSE MOST ARTIST don't put there heart into the music and therefore it sucks!!!!"

 

That's totally bullshit Tomer..and again a lame excuse.. How do you know that? It's about taste not if you think we make it the right way or not or put our hearts into it!

 

I suggest you start making some music and then let us judge your music..It's so easy to judge other people and think you have it all figured out! before that happens I have zero respect for your opinion on this matter.

 

I am done with you!

[Guest bugbread]

Tomer, EP:

 

Slow down guys. You don't realize it, but you both agree with eachother.

 

EP has said he doesn't mind previewing, but hates the fact that in reality most people SAY previewing but then keep the MP3s without buying the CDs.

 

And Tomer is saying he only uses MP3s for previewing, not for hoarding (like Lightmatch).

 

So, you both agree with eachother. Now relax.

[Guest Elysium Project]

By the way Tomer I have never said I was into making muisc for money! If I was I would certantly never release goa/psy!

 

I am into making music because I love it and I have been making music (as an amture) since I was 14 years old...I am now 35.

 

But that dosen't mean that I don't deserve to be respected for what i do and make some money out of it... Art does not have to = suffering!

 

It is obvious to me that you've never listened to my music (like a lot of new kids to this scene haven't) but if you took the time to listen to it you would find out that I put all my heart into my music and that I am "one of a kind" since I don't sound like anyone else in this scene (I can say this with out braging). That of course does not automatically mean that you like my music which I don't expect you to but it does mean that your agrument about the heart lacking from the music is kicked to the ground for good! - That also goes for a lot of other bands/artists in this scene!

[Guest Tomer]

I've never heard your music because i've never been introduced to it before..

 

 

 

and me saying people don't put there heart into the music maybe thats a missplaced point, but thats only one of many points and you keep nitpicking at it.. the point still remains, i shouldn't have to pay for it if im never going to listen to it, i shouldn't have to have blind faith in artists. thats the point im making.. Like you said you don't expect me to like your music, so i give it a chance first by downloading it on mp3 and then if i like it, i will buy it..

 

thats the point im trying to make..

 

i said point like 5 times there..