The cancers of todays Psy scene

[Goa Bill]

Nemo was owned big time by Rotwang.

Nemo, you have to learn to differentiate between people and tastes. I don't like Dark Psy any more than you are but I am sure there are many nice, passionate and intelligent fans of that stuff out there. Many of them are posting on this forum. It may killed Psy Trance for me and for you but it revived it for other people. I mourn it but also totally understand it. It's like when Nirvana and Pearl Jam killed Hair Metal. Something ends and something else starts instead. Ok bad example because Hair Metal sucked and it deserved to die.

When Psytrance was alive for you?

 

Nemo? Pavel? Anyone else?

Psy Trance died for me in 2006. The last decent psy trance year.

 

I think we can agree on something so far:

Ethno samples in Psy Chill suck

[amphiton]

I think we can agree on something so far:

Ethno samples in Psy Chill suck

Agreed. Though I enjoy good quality ethno instruments and vocal recorded live

[fluffymushi]

Then dont continue the discussion. If you can not take a good old battle

 

Anyways, One question, is Trentemoller Psychedelic to you? For me it is!

trentemollur is the most emo shit ever.

 

 

 

I've been thinking too much about you

I've been staring at the floor

I've listened to all the tunes i love

But made me feel quite blue

 

blablablaaablablablablablaablaaaaa blablablablaablabblablaaaaaaaaaa

[fluffymushi]

srsly that's the last thing you wanna hear when having a psychedelic experience.

 

imo.

[Rotwang]

srsly that's the last thing you wanna hear when having a psychedelic experience.

 

imo.

I don't know about that. I think I'd rather hear that than the kind of thing Vegetal puts in his tracks.

[NEMO.BOFH]

However you can get OWNED for your taste opinion is over my head. Nobody can or WILL win this argument. Rotwang has his opinion, I have mine, as so many others. I would say it is an UN-WINNABLE argument.

 

Anyways, as for Minimal, I think without Minimal, you would not have "Dark Psy". However, without minimal we would not have other acts either, so whatever it spawned, it was good for many parties.

 

As for Dark Psy killing the Psy movement, I have to admit, I was "trolling" a bit, and I do not really think it killed the psy scene, it divided it. Which in my opinion is the good way, as I still can chose to not go, if there is dark psy being played.

 

Psychedelic, can not be defined, thats true, because what to one person is Psychedelic is to another pure horror or just plain boring.

 

and oh, Rotwang, you said that Dark Psy bashing is old, well, I have seen you participating in other genre bashing, so... we bash what we dislike or do not agree with, thats our nature, nothing more. I dont care what you think about the music I like, I dont take it personal when someone says that Scorb sucks or that OOOD is the biggest load of bollox there is... The only ones we are hurting by saying bad things, are the artists feelings. (not that I think that IM cares anyways what anyone on ANY forum says, they are well happy with their success hehe)

 

So there you go, Rotwang

[abasio]

Cancers of the scene?

 

Hmmm.....

 

People who judge without trying/caring.

 

The number of times I've heard that psytrance is dead. There is no good music being produced/released. All music made since 2000 sucks or whatever is really annoying.

I really feel that these people think everything sucks so they just don't bother even listening, but then just complain that it sucks anyway.

 

When I first got into Psy there was probably about 20 albums released a year, 10 great albums & 10 shit ones. Now there are hundreds of releases each year, most of them shit but there is every year great stuff that I truly love. That means the scene (for me) is still alive. In fact it's better than ever. There is too much music I want to buy & I can't buy it all because I don't have the money I still love my old Goa albums but I love the new stuff too.

 

I'm sure people are judging without listening half the time!

 

 

Also Simon Posford mania. No his farts are not music. Everything he touches does not turn to gold. He is not Gus Till

 

Shanty shanty chill out has out stayed it's welcome.

 

Fullon became generic crap.

 

Shops putting anything made by ex psy producers under the psytrance section at the record shop

 

 

:wank:

[Ormion]

+0. I don't think that darkpsy and melody generally mix - or maybe they can, but it's real hard to pull off, and I can't think of many exceptions (though KDD's Shivaya Voda springs to mind).

I agree that melody and darkpsy is very difficult to mix. Possibly this is why I wanna listen more of it. Shivaya Voda is a perfect example or Savage Scream-Alternative.

I'm a melody lover, but I don't wanna see darkpsy going full melodic that's for sure. But a few more haunting melodies is something that I would higly appreciate.

[karan129]

I too initially thought psy was dead, but then later realised that as Basilik mentioned, its the signal to noise thing. There is enough good psy out there, you just need to find it IMO dark psy is psychedelic enough, its the progressive part that I dislike.

 

To me progressive psy is .... HOUSE, nothing more.

[Drosophila]

To me progressive psy is .... HOUSE, nothing more.

To me there is only one label that still produces psychedelic progressive (as in sounding psychedelic ) and thats Zenon...! And that's not because it's still producing the same music, they r simply on a different path than the rest (Iboga etc.)...

 

 

Just a note to the whole darkpsy debate: here in Copenhagen it's the "same types" of people u see at the "dark"psy parties as u would at an goa party... but there are far between any of those events happening here! Its only crappy foool-on (not the good stuff, it always get's canceled ).

And the types u see at the average fullon party here is people on steroids and knives in their panties well not all of them and that's pretty much the worst thing, the people at the regular parties here!!!

[Negrosex]

Conformity.

 

Genres.

 

Elitism.

 

"sound quality" (as in less layers = punchier, phatter tracks).

[Alectrance]

cancer is weakness lovers and noises lovers

[DaZeD]

Bah!

Why so much hate towards darkpsy?

I admit, like a rough 90 % of the darkpsy released today is just childish and camouflaged full-on, I don't like that either, but amoung these there are still top notch 100% pure psychedelic tracks.

It's up to the DJ to identify the dark pearls.

 

What does darkpsy mean anymore anyway, you have so many different kinds of darkpsy that there should be a new word invented to discribe the "good stuff", I mean the underground, filthy, dirty, screaming and scratching, mindraping, sanity attackers.Darpsy is not darkpsy anymore, you know.

 

Actually, no genre killed the "scene" imo, the only thing that changed is that it all began to become very mainstream and kinda commercial, and there is a croud for the lame "darkpsy" and "full-on," I dunno, like the club people or something, but most of them don't even understand the better music, they just like to kick there feet on a repetitive tune with hard bass, without experiencing a whole world of fantasy behind the curtains.

 

There is no scene, there are scenes now.

I think there will allways be an "underground" croud for old-shool goa and raw crazy darkpsy, and vica versa.

Just don't listen to shitty full-on and shitty darkpsy, don't go to that kind of parties, just kinda ignore it.

[Padmapani]

Way to miss the point. Darkpsy doesn't sell more. In fact if you actually look at psyshop's chart like Ormion suggested you'll find very little darkpsy. Quite how anybody can claim that a subgenre which makes up a tiny fraction of psytrance sales compared to, say, progressive is killing the scene is beyond me.

it doesn't matter how much they sell. it matters how much it is played at parties. over here they play progressive until like 4 or 5 people arrive at the party, then they switch to darkpsy. no change in music until the sun begins to rise - then they play even harder darkpsy (honestly WTF?!?). if it's an indoor party the venue closes at 6:00 or 7:00 while there's still darkpsy running. if it's an outdoor party they change to cheesy fullon at 7:00 and then to progressive at something like 8:00. at festivals i don't want to dance in the night anymore.

 

how does that not kill the scene if there's some people who don't like dark?

 

if it weren't for some good psychedelic progressive that's sometimes played instead of the housy stuff, i wouldn't bother going to festivals anymore.

 

My experience of the darkpsy scene is that it has a lot more in common with how people describe the early days of psytrance than any other scene at the moment. Have you ever been to a darkpsy festival? Look at this photo I took last year

maybe it's different where you live. at a local darkpsy party you find 30-50% of people with camouflage baggypants and baseball caps, whereas at a progressive party the people look just like on the photo you posted.

also the darkpsy parties are the ones where bags and clothes are stolen. doesn't happen at the (few! ) other parties.

 

There is no scene, there are scenes now.

not if they whole psy scene from goa to progressive to darkpsy is only about 200 people where you live

 

What utter rubbish. I don't know much about the history of psytrance, but it's nonetheless obvious to my ears that darkpsy has evolved continuously from old psytrance. Listen to this, by old-school favourites Etnica, and try telling me that doesn't sound like darkpsy. Listen to this by The Nommos and try telling me that you can't see how that's a natural progression from old-school psytrance.

that example you have given is a weak one. that etnica track is rubbish compared to the marvellous pieces that are on Alien Protein or IFO.

 

in respose to the original post:

 

"Full On Basslines"

agreed

 

"Minimalism"

yes and no. i like some laid back minimal progressive at daytime when it's too hot to be dancing, but still it has gone too far.

 

"House, Progressive Techno, Tech House etc. influences

Why?"

agreed

 

"No melodies in Darkpsy"

agreed. there are some darkpsy tracks with nice melodies but i've never heard one of them at a party.

 

"Ethno-cliches in ambient

We have enough, don't you think? The same with all these dub stuff. Where's the spacey psybient? The trancey melodies? Why everything must sound so earthly today?"

yep. i don't like that ethno stuff. the dub stuff is nice though. the ideal combination is dub stuff with trancey spacey melodies like some ambient tracks from mwnn. i still like the non-dub stuff with spacey trancey stuff a lot.

 

"Extreme bpm's

150 is good, 160 is good, 200 not like. The same with 120 bpm dance tracks. No thanks!"

agreed. although i prefer 140-150. stomping is getting tiring with 160

 

"Obsession with Goa"

no fucking way! Goa>>Everything else

 

"Obsession with Simon"

i don't care. he's good but no that good

 

"Vocoding samples"

fully agreed. nothing worse than that. even darkpsy is better.

 

"No liquid sounds"

agreed

 

"People afraid of Trance"

agreed

[Novacron]

TRUE analog is nearly falling off the face of the earth. Very few analog machines are being produced today.

[psytones]

My thoughts:

 

Minimalism

How the most colorful, intense, complex dance genre has become such minimal-styled I will never understand. Shame.

I don't hate minimal. It's just not my taste. But everything leans towards minimalism. Like it's the future of our scene. Whilst over-the-top psy is regarded as a b-grade music, music for the few.

 

acid are technological stylish in this mosakk - high tech acid : technology

 

No melodies in Darkpsy

I love Darkpsy. But why most Darkpsy artists don't use melodies? It's like a cliche?

 

many use melodiaseses in other dimension

 

Ethno-cliches in ambient

We have enough, don't you think? The same with all these dub stuff. Where's the spacey psybient? The trancey melodies? Why everything must sound so earthly today?

 

piefactor - endless universe !!! :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

 

Extreme bpm's

150 is good, 160 is good, 200 not like. The same with 120 bpm dance tracks. No thanks!

 

200 wat u mean, like Peace for da wickedo Varies/Artist?

 

Obsession with Goa

And this comes from THE Goa fan. I love Goa more than anything, but Psy is more than that.

graceland

 

Obsession with Simon

Serioulsy, this is getting ridiculous.

 

we all need a superstar an inspirtation - even people outside the liking sound of pietrance dunk dunk (sometimes) knew the name simon postford

 

Vocoding samples

Too many of them and most of them annoying as hell. Especially in cheesy full on tracks. Plus anything ''I love you'' clubby, shitty sample.

Plur has nothing to do with that.

 

amen! - ghb mosakk

 

No liquid sounds

Everything sounds so ''rough'' today. Why?

 

try some ambient by fraggeltrollelsd chill projekt . some tracks made me feel like inside a aquariums tank. very moist and liquid

 

People afraid of Trance

Damn you X-Dream! Damn you Radio!

I don't know, but there are times that I think that trance today is like a forbidden word. Like Trance=Cheese. Why?

Count me words. If Spiritual Healing was released today, it would be bashed as a cheesefest.

 

its very hard to not make ost

[Veracohr]

Extreme bpm's

150 is good, 160 is good, 200 not like. The same with 120 bpm dance tracks. No thanks!

I generally refrain from blatant self promotion in forums that aren't intended for it, but I'd like to invite you to listen to my track Panta Rhei. It's not psy, nor is it a masterpiece by any means, but IS 120bpm, and I think it's quite danceable and enjoyable at 120bpm.

[psytones]

Infect Insect (aka 200 bpm artists).

crazy stuff man. anyone bothered tripping on this stuff? complexed mucision for sko

[Veracohr]

TRUE analog is nearly falling off the face of the earth. Very few analog machines are being produced today.

Not entirely. New analog manufacturers pop up from time to time.

 

http://www.davesmithinstruments.com

http://www.future-retro.com/

http://www.doepfer.de/

http://www.vermona.com/index.php?en_news

http://www.synthtech.com/

http://www.synthesizers.com/index.html

http://www.blacet.com/

http://www.modcan.com/

http://www.paia.com/

http://www.analoguesystems.co.uk/index2.htm

http://www.moogmusic.com/

http://www.jomox.com

 

And more...

[qa2pir]

I generally refrain from blatant self promotion in forums that aren't intended for it, but I'd like to invite you to listen to my track Panta Rhei. It's not psy, nor is it a masterpiece by any means, but IS 120bpm, and I think it's quite danceable and enjoyable at 120bpm.

There are countless of house and techno tunes in that bpm range so it's nothing new.

 

Blatant self promotion it is.

[Colin OOOD]

A cancer of today's scene is people insisting on putting trance into smaller and smaller pigeonholes and dissing everything in a pigeonhole they heard one track of and didn't like.

A cancer of today's scene is people giving those pigeonholes individual names, then using those individual names to create divisions between each other.

A cancer of today's scene is people with preferences for individual sub-sub-genres insisting that their favourite music is the only one that has carried on the true lineage from goa trance, when really they all have.

A cancer of today's scene is the insistence of "I'm right and you're wrong".

A cancer of today's scene is me thinking my opinion means anything at all.

 

There are more, but the last thing you guys need is an emo producer moaning about shit.

 

After this post it will be a cancer of today's scene if this thread continues.

[Anoebis]

Real cancer isn't there yet, just some cells that are on the way on becoming a cancer I think...

 

The biggest problem is the need for $$$, which makes many artist release commercial music, I think there are the roots of todays progressive/minimal and full on psy trance, because the artists needed a wider public to earn the same amount of money...

 

Is that a problem? I don't know... And I don't really care, as long as there is enough good music, and there is I think

[Ormion]

"Obsession with Goa"

no fucking way! Goa>>Everything else

I think you misunderstood me here. I don't have anything against Goa. Actually Goa is my all time favorite style. Always was, is and will be. But I don't agree with the obsession about Goa, you know that it's not Goa it's not good. Of course that's me. If someone likes only Goa and nothing more is ok, but from my point of view there's more than that. Including the real Goa evolution which I still search.

 

crazy stuff man. anyone bothered tripping on this stuff? complexed mucision for sko

Actually Infect Insect is not a 200 bpm artist Most of his tracks are around 160-165, but they sound so damn fast! I like his experimental view of music, but all of the tracks I've heard by him are too similar and eventually simple to fully enjoy them.

[Rotwang]

A cancer of today's scene is people insisting on putting trance into smaller and smaller pigeonholes and dissing everything in a pigeonhole they heard one track of and didn't like.

[...]

A cancer of today's scene is people with preferences for individual sub-sub-genres insisting that their favourite music is the only one that has carried on the true lineage from goa trance, when really they all have.

I don't know whether this was directed at me, but in case it was I'll say a few words in my defence: I haven't intentionally dissed stuff which isn't darkpsy, nor did I ever mean to suggest that it's "the only one that has carried on the true lineage from Goa trance"; I agree that they all have (in fact I like lots of stuff which isn't darkpsy, much like all the darkpsy listeners on this forum AFAIK). It's just that when somebody accuses the music I like of killing the scene, and calls people who share my taste "scum", I feel like I should defend it, especially when that person backs up their claim with statements that are demonstrably false.

 

A cancer of today's scene is people giving those pigeonholes individual names, then using those individual names to create divisions between each other.

I don't entirely agree with this - when a genre evolves in different directions it's natural that some people will like some directions more than others, and I think it's good that there exist parties and festivals which cater just for those people who like dark or progressive or minimal or whatever best. "Division" needn't mean "hostility".

[seraph]

Nothing really matters nowadays when Tetrahedron is finally about to be released.