CompactStick - the successor of the CD

[Daniël]

From a professional point of view the CD is the work of the devil. Its vulnerable, it needs a rotating engine that uses alot of power and is vulnerable too, the player has a response time, it doesnt play directly, once a CD is broken its just garbage, very annoying and polluting garbage by the way.

 

And a USbstick plays the moment you plug it, no response time...at all , no rotating engines, less power usage. You can put extras on the stick, its very easy to back up, its compatible with anything that has a usb port.

 

The USB sticks simply have alot more endurability, flexibility and reliability.

[Goa-Head]

From a professional point of view the CD is the work of the devil.

This must be the post of the month!

[Goa Bill]

Laser Disc, MD, CompactStick, HD DVD

Welcome everybody to the redundant formats museum

[Ormion]

Yes, and music is not an object!

Well yes that's what I mean. Music is music wherever it comes from, but cds are objects and it's probably my fetish.

 

@ Malevolent

 

Just to make it clear. Every cd I buy I rip it in my PC, cause after all I don't own a hi-fi.

This whole cd fetish that comes from me and other guys is based on two simple things.

First: from a collector point of view there's simply no such thing as digital file collector. Period.

Second: The reason I want to have a cd is to 'feel' that is there. To see it even when my pc is closed.

 

Yep it's a fetish, I don't disagree about that, but still CD FTW!!!

[NEMO.BOFH]

Well yes that's what I mean. Music is music wherever it comes from, but cds are objects and it's probably my fetish.

 

@ Malevolent

 

Just to make it clear. Every cd I buy I rip it in my PC, cause after all I don't own a hi-fi.

This whole cd fetish that comes from me and other guys is based on two simple things.

First: from a collector point of view there's simply no such thing as digital file collector. Period.

Second: The reason I want to have a cd is to 'feel' that is there. To see it even when my pc is closed.

 

Yep it's a fetish, I don't disagree about that, but still CD FTW!!!

No such thing as a digital file collector?! LOL!!!!!! I have a couple of TB that proves you wrong!

[Ormion]

No such thing as a digital file collector?! LOL!!!!!! I have a couple of TB that proves you wrong!

Oh c'mon!! You know what I mean. Give me one month and a good internet connection and I will have the entire psytrance music that has ever released in my HDD.

[Basilisk]

In lossless quality?

 

I thought so.

[RTP]

Well, the industry sometimes do not listen or want to listen to what the wider audience wants... they just enforce something, and thats it. We will then, be left without any saying or choice.

 

Of course, these sticks are good, if you live in a country with little or no bandwidth to download WAVE files, but I still think its a step backwards to use physical media for a medium which is supposed to be a non-physical one. I will NEVER buy one of those sticks!

yep, I definitely agree ... it should be a download and not a USB stick

 

oh and I don't think Psyshop has enough power to convert the whole scene to CompactSticks ... the customers, that's us, we will decide!

 

Fetishize the object of delivery or the music it contains? Physicality is no longer an overriding concern for me. I'll take the 18 Tb and the girl over a wall of paper and plastic products.

I don't quite agree with this. If I had that many CDs as in that pic, then maybe yes ... but as of now I have maybe two rows of one rack, which is not that much...

 

I really don't understand why people have to feel something in their hands. It's not like you're actually touching the CD while its spinning in your cd player.

 

The CD Player just reads the digital data that's on the CD and sends analog signals to the speakers. Just because it's wrapped in plastic doesn't change the fact that it's just binary data. Binary data that is later interpreted into analog signals. Fuck man, give it a break allready, it's DIGITAL ANYWAYS. You can wrap it up in seven boxes but it wouldnt make a difference.

 

Why is it lame to play music via a computer but not via a cd player? It's the same bloody thing. Computers are just a bit more complex because they have more then just one assignment like the cd player (which is to just do D/A basically). Do you think that music artists use a PEN to write music onto the CD? Cmon man! This whole touching objects thing is ridiculous!

I gotta admit that physical sound carriers have some sort of fascination to me ... especially CDs and vinyls because you gotta be careful to them. What many people percieve as a hassle, to treat their stuff with the necessary care so that it doesn't get scratches, is actually a pleasure to me. I like to take the CD out of its case slowly and put it very carefully into the player. I don't know, but I value it a lot and I get sad when I buy used CDs which were not treated with care and are scratched. But it's not the physical medium I'm attached so much, it's not a physical fetishism, I rather think of the music ... when I put a CD into my hifi, I put music into it. And this music I like to treat with care because that way I show respect to it. When I don't respect the music, I don't treat the CD with any care ... also vinyl. I got vinyl or CDs which I almost scratch with intention, because I don't give a flying fk about the stuff that's on them...

This is why I also get sad when I see scratched CDs. Their owners obviously didn't give the music respect, otherwise they'd have treated it with more care. It's all about the music, never about the object itself.

 

With CompactStick (or digital downloads too) the times of care and the times of respect in that form are over for me. And that's the sorta sentimental reason why I don't want these Sticks (or downloads). Together with the practical reasons there are too many disadvantages for me so that I won't buy one, even for 6 bonus tracks of one of my favourite artists. Although my last word on this isn't spoken definitely yet. Maybe a used one will do sometime...

[Ormion]

I gotta admit that physical sound carriers have some sort of fascination to me ... especially CDs and vinyls because you gotta be careful to them. What many people percieve as a hassle, to treat their stuff with the necessary care so that it doesn't get scratches, is actually a pleasure to me. I like to take the CD out of its case slowly and put it very carefully into the player. I don't know, but I value it a lot and I get sad when I buy used CDs which were not treated with care and are scratched. But it's not the physical medium I'm attached so much, it's not a physical fetishism, I rather think of the music ... when I put a CD into my hifi, I put music into it. And this music I like to treat with care because that way I show respect to it. When I don't respect the music, I don't treat the CD with any care ... also vinyl. I got vinyl or CDs which I almost scratch with intention, because I don't give a flying fk about the stuff that's on them...

This is why I also get sad when I see scratched CDs. Their owners obviously didn't give the music respect, otherwise they'd have treated it with more care. It's all about the music, never about the object itself.

+1

Plus there's one more reason why I love cds so much. They are full of memories. Watching my cd collection (which is still small) I get images and memories for each cd. My first one, the one I bought in a ridiculous high price, a rare cd I found in a local store, the first time I listened to this amazing release etc.

Download Gigas of tracks with one click doesn't really feel the same way.

Am I too emotional? Maybe, but it feels good

 

Ok enough off topic from me.

[Malevol3nt]

But don't you get it guys? You're just hanging on to something temporary. You might of for example loved vinyl in the old days but now all you buy is cds. When some new carrier comes up you emotionally attach yourself to it. It doesn't make any sense at all. You should all be connected to the MUSIC, not the sound carrier.

 

CD-ROM's or Hard Disk Platters, it's the same thing (yeah technically not but it's close enough). The only reason you never see someone spinning a hard drive instead of a cd is because it's unpopular and thus would look rediculous to you. This whole CD-loving has to do with what is popular, not what 'feels right'. The reason you love CD's so much is because you got used to them, they did afterall became a world-wide standard.

 

But history repeats itself, over and over again. Next you'll attach yourself emotionally to these USB sticks, untill something new comes up. And then you will hate the new standard, say how USB sticks were so awesome, but after a while you will move on. And over and over again. Standard after standard.

 

In it's essence it's just music, what difference is it on what surface it is carried on? Vinyl might have made a difference (since it really does change the way that music actually sounds - for better or worse), but digital music will sound the same on any type of digital carrier.

 

To me music is music in whichever form it comes in. And the reason I said CompactSticks won't make it to the market is simply because it's too late for marketing this kind of product, especially now that digital downloads have expanded so much.

[Ormion]

But don't you get it guys? You're just hanging on to something temporary. You might of for example loved vinyl in the old days but now all you buy is cds. When some new carrier comes up you emotionally attach yourself to it. It doesn't make any sense at all. You should all be connected to the MUSIC, not the sound carrier.

 

CD-ROM's or Hard Disk Platters, it's the same thing (yeah technically not but it's close enough). The only reason you never see someone spinning a hard drive instead of a cd is because it's unpopular and thus would look rediculous to you. This whole CD-loving has to do with what is popular, not what 'feels right'. The reason you love CD's so much is because you got used to them, they did afterall became a world-wide standard.

 

But history repeats itself, over and over again. Next you'll attach yourself emotionally to these USB sticks, untill something new comes up. And then you will hate the new standard, say how USB sticks were so awesome, but after a while you will move on. And over and over again. Standard after standard.

 

In it's essence it's just music, what difference is it on what surface it is carried on? Vinyl might have made a difference (since it really does change the way that music actually sounds - for better or worse), but digital music will sound the same on any type of digital carrier.

 

To me music is music in whichever form it comes in. And the reason I said CompactSticks won't make it to the market is simply because it's too late for marketing this kind of product, especially now that digital downloads have expanded so much.

Don't confuse the way we feel about music with the way we feel about the physical media.

To put it better. You can have a hi-res image of mona lisa in your pc and watch it every day. Does this chance the art behind it? No. Can you appreciate Da Vinci's genious just by looking the digital pic? Of course you can. But having the real painting itself feels way too different.

 

Like I said I don't own a hi-fi so everytime I buy a cd I rip it in my pc. As you can see I don't have anything against digital files.

It's not about music itself. Music wil be music, even if it's coming from a cd, a hdd or youtube.

Of course I have used to cds, just like some older guy have used to vinyls. And even today he keeps bying vinyls. Why does he do that? He loves it, simple as that.

[Otto Matta]

I can see the argument for MP3s. It really has been a great success, and the majority of people really don't seem to care about the difference. The stick probably really isn't the answer, although you have to admit it has been one of the more interesting contenders recently. I like the idea of it, but it seems, after all, that there's going to need to be a much bigger technological revolution to replace what we have now. Maybe we just have to wait a little while until we get through this trough of compressed formats to a time not too long from now when memory will be such that we don't have to compress everything anymore, in a way that is personal, like music had always been until MP3. Maybe at that point people will be willing to pay more for the increased value - like they did with CDs after tapes - and help the music industry regain some equilibrium.

 

What's the next MTV going to be? That should be fun.

[NEMO.BOFH]

The Music Industry that we know needs to cease to exist first, and then we will see R A V E O L U T I O N

[Daniël]

This must be the post of the month!

Thank you, it can go on my psynews wall of "weird quotes"-fame. Id like to collect my prize now!

 

seriously, you should come and hang around with me for a week, ill show you every weak spot of the CD.

 

a small example(true story, very annoying): imagine you have to play 20 tracks of around 15 sec in a period of 3 hours. IN this period is a gap of 35 minutes between 2 tracks. Any CD-player has a moment where the pauzed CD goes to sleep modus, this is mostly 10, 20 or 30 minutes. It cant be longer cause, a longer pause than 30 minutes can damage the gear or CD(and im talking about DENON players here), sleep modus cant be switched off. So because the limitations of the technology youll have to remember to open & close the CDplayer in the 35 minute gap, otherwise the CD player will go to sleep modus a few minutes before you have to play the track. And imagine you forget this and play the track while the player is in sleepmodus, it takes about 3 to 5 sec to start up the engine, find the right cluster and play, those are looooong seconds.

 

sorry, Exit CD, the sooner the better...

 

From a personal point of view i dont think the CD will vanish soon, its very compatible with alot of other technologies, as long as there will be DVDplayers that are compatible to play and write CDs it will stay on the market. But if you put all the different formats next to each other the only thing i can see in CDs is good marketing. At the moment a cheap selfsustaining marketing cause of the emotional connection alot of people have with it.

I dont think in replacing formats anymore, thats so 80s, i think the hardware will just become multifuntional, how hard is it to transform all pro & DJ gear into something with a USB port. And everybody with a computer can allready play it.

 

I will buy compactsticks, at least one, pink floyd - dark side of the moon, hehe, i want to check out each format with this music, even if the format is doomed to vanish.

[NEMO.BOFH]

Thank you, it can go on my psynews wall of "weird quotes"-fame. Id like to collect my prize now!

 

seriously, you should come and hang around with me for a week, ill show you every weak spot of the CD.

 

a small example(true story, very annoying): imagine you have to play 20 tracks of around 15 sec in a period of 3 hours. IN this period is a gap of 35 minutes between 2 tracks. Any CD-player has a moment where the pauzed CD goes to sleep modus, this is mostly 10, 20 or 30 minutes. It cant be longer cause, a longer pause than 30 minutes can damage the gear or CD(and im talking about DENON players here), sleep modus cant be switched off. So because the limitations of the technology youll have to remember to open & close the CDplayer in the 35 minute gap, otherwise the CD player will go to sleep modus a few minutes before you have to play the track. And imagine you forget this and play the track while the player is in sleepmodus, it takes about 3 to 5 sec to start up the engine, find the right cluster and play, those are looooong seconds.

 

sorry, Exit CD, the sooner the better...

 

From a personal point of view i dont think the CD will vanish soon, its very compatible with alot of other technologies, as long as there will be DVDplayers that are compatible to play and write CDs it will stay on the market. But if you put all the different formats next to each other the only thing i can see in CDs is good marketing. At the moment a cheap selfsustaining marketing cause of the emotional connection alot of people have with it.

I dont think in replacing formats anymore, thats so 80s, i think the hardware will just become multifuntional, how hard is it to transform all pro & DJ gear into something with a USB port. And everybody with a computer can allready play it.

 

I will buy compactsticks, at least one, pink floyd - dark side of the moon, hehe, i want to check out each format with this music, even if the format is doomed to vanish.

Number 1 Post in this thread! +100!

[Anoebis]

In lossless quality?

 

I thought so.

I know someone that has it, altough he has "only" a few hundred goa cds

[MattMan]

If you're listening at home for your own pleasure use whatever format you like. It's different when you play out though... I think you need to take things seriously. Given that psytrance is such a highly technical form of music, quality matters. I've not heard any good reason to compromise on quality--especially since hard drives are so cheap, and the only thing you really gain from the MP3 format is file size savings and portability.

Yes, quality matters, I'll be the first to say it. I'm probably one of the biggest Hi-Fi maniacs I know of, and I've built my home entertainment system with as few bottlenecks as possible. Yet, doing a proper ABX blind-test, I concluded that I couldn't hear a difference between 320kpbs MP3 | 320kpbs WAW | FLAC | CD.

 

I'm tempted to suggest that normal venue PA systems' speakers and amps is a far greater bottleneck in terms of sound quality from source to ear than a 256kpbs MP3 file ever could be compared to FLAC or 320.

 

You're right though, there's no need to compromise quality if you don't have to.

 

But when it comes to complex music that has numerous layers and uses a really wide spectrum of sounds, then the differences between Wav's (or Flac's) and Mp3's become more apparent. Again to me, because I listen loud and really deep, and I can hear that difference.

You're right, loudness is a recurring factor in many pop/rock albums. (

) However, I think the quality of the recording of any album matters equally. Ordinairy musical instruments are very dynamic..

 

 

It's not hard to understand that some people can hear differences in recordings, and I am taking this seriously... erm.

[Daniël]

oh my god!!! thank you :posford: :posford: :posford:

That will be very usefull.

You have any more of these kind of diagrams???

[MattMan]

Google "*instrument* frequency spectrum" or the likes. Very easy to find.

 

I must say I'm emotionally attached to the "CD" for what it's worth. That's why I've got difficulties with downloading (buying) albums and new things such as the stick. The minidisc was terrible and I've never been into LP's.

 

For me though, it's all about the speakers / headphones for the final touch of the sound, once everything else is in order. Source quality, digital-to-analouge conversion, cables, amplification etc.

[Malevol3nt]

I do hope these compact sticks are read-only tho. Otherwise they could be easily volnurable to virus infiltrations. Of course this can happen with any writable medium.

[Malevol3nt]

Don't confuse the way we feel about music with the way we feel about the physical media.

To put it better. You can have a hi-res image of mona lisa in your pc and watch it every day. Does this chance the art behind it? No. Can you appreciate Da Vinci's genious just by looking the digital pic? Of course you can. But having the real painting itself feels way too different.

Yeah you might of had a point there. But Da Vinci drew the picture originally on paper and not on a computer screen, that's why its special.

 

But how about digital artists? Would you appreciate their work more on a printed paper or a screen, even tho they drew their paintings on a computer screen? If you would stay true to the source, then you would have to appreciate it more on a computer screen.

 

Music artists on the other hand recorded their music onto hard drives and memmories (doesn't matter if they used hardware synths or not). They didn't directly record the music onto the CD's. So there's nothing 'real' about CD's when it comes to music.

 

That being said I don't mind people who love CD's in a special way. But CD's are merely just a copy of a work of music art and a nice cover picture on it. The only reason why the music industry chose CD's instead of any other format is because they were a good format at that time. Unfortunately for the music industry, they overlooked the possibility of expansion and were not willing to move forward as technology progressed over time. And because of that they run into problems with digital downloads. And because of that the switch from CD's to another format such as digital downloads is so painful at this time, because people got used to the CD format for too long to just let go of it now.

 

If the music industry actually had any sense to it, we wouldn't even had CD's by this time and age. They would be pretty much extinct by now. (Legal) digital downloads would be known for years allready and would be the driving force of the industry. They made a mistake by not following the trends of technology, and now because of their mistakes they're loosing their money. It's their own fault, even tho they want to blame it on piracy. It's as simple as that.

[p(sy)ayam]

the problem with (legal) digital downloads is that there is no difference between the legal one and the pirated one!

i'm sure CDs would be replaced with something else in future but i don't see the potential in memory sticks. i can imagine how ridiculous a memory stick collection would look!!! looking for a specific album in your pile of memory sticks would be a pain in the ass as well. but all these said, if (and only if) i can buy a USB connector for my amp for cheap i will buy few albums on memory stick

[NEMO.BOFH]

the problem with (legal) digital downloads is that there is no difference between the legal one and the pirated one!

i'm sure CDs would be replaced with something else in future but i don't see the potential in memory sticks. i can imagine how ridiculous a memory stick collection would look!!! looking for a specific album in your pile of memory sticks would be a pain in the ass as well. but all these said, if (and only if) i can buy a USB connector for my amp for cheap i will buy few albums on memory stick

If its ripped from CD or from the WEB makes the difference. If from web, there is no difference, if from CD it gets ripped to 192vbr...

[MattMan]

i can imagine how ridiculous a memory stick collection would look!!!

Well, I'm sure a collection of key-chain looking memory sticks would look like rubbish - but just because the medium itself has to change doesn't mean they can't place them in jewel-cases just like CD's, see post #1. I wouldnt mind that - if the compact stick really was the future. The estethics are thus preserved. :posford:

[NEMO.BOFH]

Well, I'm sure a collection of key-chain looking memory sticks would look like rubbish - but just because the medium itself has to change doesn't mean they can't place them in jewel-cases just like CD's, see post #1. I wouldnt mind that - if the compact stick really was the future. The estethics are thus preserved. :posford:

Stinking Hippies! Do you not know that PLASTIC is bad for the environment!? I really love how people scream ENVIRONMENT and then they buy cds with Jewel Cases cause they love the format and want a pretty picture. One argument more to skip the whole PHYSICAL media for music!