Why do psy artists become less "psy" over time?

[afgin]

Afgin, question for you: What about a lot of people who killed someone because of alcohol, or what about people who are very agressive while they're drinking? Here in Croatia I know a bunch of people who become primitive animal after few shots.

 

Point here is that every drug or even alcohol can be bad for someone who can't control it or doesn't know how to act during usage of mentioned.

 

agree with you on this one,taking too much from that can kill you,but...please...dont compare between drinking few shots of vodka,and using acid,the damage that could be from acid is much worse then drinking few shots of vodka,and i like drink vodka somtimes,and i know a lot of pepole drink that,but those pepole are going to work day after,study and etc...

 

but i know a lot of pepole that for only using one time acid,their brain just f***d up forever,only from ONE TIME TAKING IT.

 

so i perfer drink once in a while vodka shots,then to take only once acid,that could F****d my brain,forever.

 

now i am not saying that alchohol is good for health,neither cigarets,and i smoke cigarets,but please...makes the diffrence between drinking few shoots of alcohol in the weekend,then taking ONE TIME ACID,that could cause u fatal brain damage.

 

You're right, when it comes to the harm they cause it's ridiculous to compare beer to acid:

 

 

(from here)

 

 

 

 

Actually you can.

 

 

 

No, it seems that you missed my point, which was this: just because too much of X is a bad thing, that doesn't mean that X itself is a bad thing. The fact that X may not be necessary for living doesn't change that.

 

ok,so cause of this research,now everybody need to stop drinks beers,and start doing mushrooms and LSD....now the world will be better.

 

and for not eating food,well this one is good...very good,and since you like to be smart in your examples please...go try to live from this stuff...its is a real good way to live ha? yes,i am shocked how pepole dont figure to live from this stuff,who needs to eat regular food? Parenteral nutrition is the best way to live...c'mon,you are not serius,are u?

 

again,about quantity... its better to eat a lot of appels then to try to take small one little drop of acid...my point is,that there are things that u shouldnt try them from the first time,such as psy drugs,and to be honest,its better you take one drop of vodka,then taking one drop of acid...and i hope u know why,and what is the diffrence.

[@reyu]

ok,so cause of this research,now everybody need to stop drinks beers,and start doing mushrooms and LSD....now the world will be better.

 

and for not eating food,well this one is good...very good,and since you like to be smart in your examples please...go try to live from this stuff...its is a real good way to live ha? yes,i am shocked how pepole dont figure to live from this stuff,who needs to eat regular food? Parenteral nutrition is the best way to live...c'mon,you are not serius,are u?

 

again,about quantity... its better to eat a lot of appels then to try to take small one little drop of acid...my point is,that there are things that u shouldnt try them from the first time,such as psy drugs,and to be honest,its better you take one drop of vodka,then taking one drop of acid...and i hope u know why,and what is the diffrence.

 

Did you know LSD was a rather successful medicin, combined with therapy, to treat alcoholism in the 50's, before it became an infamous psychedelic drug?

 

Anyway, I'm reading this book at the moment The LSD story by John Cashman.

I advise you to read it Afgin, it's objective and tells you something about the history of psychedelic drugs, in particular LSD. I nearly finished it and liking it.

[Elysium]

I predict the nest 6 pages will be about LSD and it's marvelous wonders.

[@reyu]

I predict the nest 6 pages will be about LSD and it's marvelous wonders.

 

You should know it isn't black or white, Elysium. Much like anything in life. The guy who wrote is a REPORTER. He REPORTS, both negative and positive. Maybe you should read it too, if you haven't already, and open a thread where we can discuss it, 6 pages long.

[afgin]

Did you know LSD was a rather successful medicin, combined with therapy, to treat alcoholism in the 50's, before it became an infamous psychedelic drug?

 

Anyway, I'm reading this book at the moment The LSD story by John Cashman.

I advise you to read it Afgin, it's objective and tells you something about the history of psychedelic drugs, in particular LSD. I nearly finished it and liking it.

 

/

at the bottom line,we can argue about that for years...cause i have my point of u,and you have your point of view,and it will be never ending story,at the end my point of view is clearly regards to psy drugs,i choose not to take them now,not taking them in the past,and not taking them in the future,cause at the end,for the long term it will be a negetive effect,and you can preach for that the whole life,but i know what is good for me at the end.

 

you pepole want to use psy drugs...take care yourselfs,cause u will need that.

[@reyu]

/

at the bottom line,we can argue about that for years...cause i have my point of u,and you have your point of view,and it will be never ending story,at the end my point of view is clearly regards to psy drugs,i choose not to take them now,not taking them in the past,and not taking them in the future,cause at the end,for the long term it will be a negetive effect,and you can preach for that the whole life,but i know what is good for me at the end.

 

you pepole want to use psy drugs...take care yourselfs,cause u will need that.

 

I haven't taken LSD for over 20 years man. I am not preaching at all, besides that, I could say the same about you. I am just pointing out things aren't black and white. But I respect your opinion.

 

I love psychedelic trance/Goa. I love the music for what it is, just like music of other genres. I'm not gonna abandon this love because some people are irresponsible concerning drugs. I love the music too much to do that and I think a lot of people with me.

[Imba]

If artist cant make music when he is clear he shouldn't make music than or like most guys on party, they come and smoke too much or drink too much and that 'listen' music. But they dont know where they are and which music is.

 

IMO if you cant enjoy in some music or making it when you are clear you dont have to do that, then it seems you are doing that by force. That have some meaning like im doctor, but i can just heal my patients when im stoned or drunk, it's not healthy for anyone lol

 

I had problems because overdosing few times and really that isnt good think when you have brain damage or something like that, but fortunately, now im like before.

 

 

Now i dont need nothing really, but few beers and some smoke is good enough to keep positive vibes.

 

 

PS. Maybe you dont agree with me but thats truth, and if you cant enjoy in something so why you dont skip it?

[Ormion]

My experience, knowing them and sharing the stage with all the artists (incl. Kode IV on many occasions) and Djs all through the 90's.

 

I still don't believe anything you said. Show me footage from the nommos studio while they're producing and then I might believe you.

[reger]

Who know, maybe i leave music in few years but for sure i will not make house or pop psy trance lol

 

You newer know that

 

 

Ahhh....darkpsy fans again...

 

 

 

Baba Gil is fraud. He cant make music. Nommos is made by his Wife! All he does is passing on the bong.

 

 

 

The main reason psynews.org isn't what it used to be in the past is merely the shut-down of the off-topic section ...

 

AMEN!

 

 

I agree to that but I would not hold my horses on the off-topic ever getting back online. I think the team is too afraid it would steal the attention from the weekly 2-3 recurring topics going on now

 

+1

 

 

I predict the nest 6 pages will be about LSD and it's marvelous wonders.

 

 

Well, my 2 cents:

agree on what Basilisk posted, its that simple

Or better yet - combine all those things he mentioned and add little thing called LIFE that MOVES ON and you cant stay in 90's where there were no cell phones, there were secret PLUR parties going on and artists making living from this new Psy thing. Times change, people change, world changes, things evolve, we evolve. If you stay in one place, you start to stagnate and eventually your culture will be eaten by other cultures or simply die, its natural state of things.

[Elysium]

I still don't believe anything you said. Show me footage from the nommos studio while they're producing and then I might believe you.

 

I am not here to convince you of anything. Believe what you will. He also makes awesome Polka music.

[redscare]

I've got this theory - seems most people start out with psychedelics, and then move on to using them less frequently, or not at all, meanwhile using more of substances like alcohol or hard drugs like opiates or stimulants..

 

Lots of psy artists start out with really deep trippy work, and then their albums often become more and more mainstream, less deep and trippy - my theory is that they don't really use psychedelics much anymore, like most people, they move toward simpler and less inspiring substances..

 

Any ideas about that? Or other ideas about why it is that artists seem to put out music that is less deep/psychedelic, and more mainstream over time? There are exceptions to this obviously, but it seems people are always complaining about psy artists getting less deep as time goes on, and I agree..

 

you know, there was a book i read back in the day, maybe you've read it, _generation ecstasy_ by simon reynolds... not a lot about goa or psy in it, but his thesis is, in part, that

 

a. as the drugs and their associated experiences became more commodified, rave culture was altered in unanticipated ways, as e gave way to speed, weed and LSD, and then coke and alcohol, thereby finally arriving at a more "club" oriented experience, as opposed to a countercultural movement like spiral tribe or goa,

 

b. the scene and the music are a chicken and egg sort of dialectic, each influencing and being in turn influenced by the other,

 

c. (this last bit is now my thoughts, not reynolds's)

hence cosmic baby and jam and spoon are now deadmau5 and gareth emery, and hallucinogen is now the fucking WHITE comp on TIP, which the first time i heard it i was like WTF IS THIS SHIT DOING ON TIP???

 

just my 2c...

s

 

... little thing called LIFE that MOVES ON and you cant stay in 90's where there were no cell phones, there were secret PLUR parties going on and artists making living from this new Psy thing. Times change, people change, world changes, things evolve, we evolve. If you stay in one place, you start to stagnate and eventually your culture will be eaten by other cultures or simply die, its natural state of things.

 

well, true enough, but isn't it possible to refrain from throwing out the baby with the bathwater, as it were? can't we keep it underground and insist on psychedelic sound palettes, while also djing new talent (suntrip, UAF etc.)?

 

i know a dude who plays nothing but new beat and new wave 12"s as though it were 1992... he never plays ANYTHING new and, though much of his records are still sick as hell, he never gives anything new a chance. that is admittedly a real drawback to the sort of anachronistic thinking you're criticising here... but the alternative can't be to lose what made us special as a tribe...

 

just some thoughts, mate

s

 

I dont agree at all. Especially not when it comes to the so-called "new Goa" which IMO try to copy what has already been made (And fail IMO). That is not evolution.

 

I think an artists should do exactly what he or she wants to do. There is no rule that just because you made old-school Goa you have to make new school Goa.

 

funny story: i was listening to entheogenic's "dialogue of the speakers" and my wife (who doesn't like psy) was like "ok... so this is psychill... it sounds just like ambient techno... like old higher intelligence agency or children of dub or loop guru or something... what makes it PSY?"

 

my response: "well, frankly, ott used to make goa trance (toxic recall) and people who dig entheogenic dress like goa kids used to. so it's mainly associative, come to think of it..."

 

is psychill just ambient music made by old goa people?

 

and yes, some neogoa doesn't innovate enough. but lots of it does! anoebis isn't just some nostalgic cultural archaeologist... he's totally relevant in 2011 IMO...

[Penzoline]

I'm gonna have to ask for people to stop double/triple posting. It's not hard to quote something, copy the quote, then go back and quote another and repeat until you are done and then finally paste it all on a new post and type your thoughts there.

[healium]

Anyone who drinks caffeine, alcohol, and smokes cigarettes, but doesn't consider themselves a "drug user" is laughably ignorant..

 

IMO, people who use only psychedelics are less deserving of the name "drug users" than the guy who drinks alcohol and caffeine... alcohol and caffeine produce states of mind more along the lines of what people think of when they say someone is drugged than do psychedelics.

 

It's all cultural brainwashing - they created a division between alcohol, caffeine, cigarettes on one hand, and "drugs" on the other hand. However, in reality, *no such division exists*

[visine]

Anyone who drinks caffeine, alcohol, and smokes cigarettes, but doesn't consider themselves a "drug user" is laughably ignorant..

 

IMO, people who use only psychedelics are less deserving of the name "drug users" than the guy who drinks alcohol and caffeine... alcohol and caffeine produce states of mind more along the lines of what people think of when they say someone is drugged than do psychedelics.

 

It's all cultural brainwashing - they created a division between alcohol, caffeine, cigarettes on one hand, and "drugs" on the other hand. However, in reality, *no such division exists*

 

 

Common dude, are you serious?

 

You can drink 2 liters of Coca Cola full of caffeine, it will not alter your state of mind to the tune of a hit of LSD..........it will however probably make you piss a lot though

[Go-Goa Trancer]

I'm gonna have to ask for people to stop double/triple posting. It's not hard to quote something, copy the quote, then go back and quote another and repeat until you are done and then finally paste it all on a new post and type your thoughts there.

 

Or better, use the multiquote function, just near the reply button.

[redscare]

I'm gonna have to ask for people to stop double/triple posting. It's not hard to quote something, copy the quote, then go back and quote another and repeat until you are done and then finally paste it all on a new post and type your thoughts there.

 

Sorry bro... won't happen again

[ollylovesgoa]

I think drugs have a lot less to do with the scene than people think. The people who are interested in creating psychedelic music will maybe try acid or something, it could be a positive influence artistically or whatever, but if they hadn't taken the acid I doubt it would have altered the course of their art drastically. Psychedelics pull stuff out of your mind that was already there, or emphasise things, they don't make someone instantly artistic and creative. As for the debate about whether acid is good for a person or not, its completely ridiculous to say it's either outright good or bad, the nature of the substances are subjective to subjectivity's highest degree.

 

I think some psy artists change their style to a more mainstream one because of the advancement of technology. People can now hear any kind of music and swap and change and be influenced every single day for no cost. Different styles are played together etc. Back in the 90's in Goa, it was all extremely psychedelic music and the scene was isolated. Nowadays underground music is less isolated style for style, artists will evolve.

 

I don't think it's a major issue anyway, psychedelic music will never die out, it's too special. Artists that change style to a mainstream style will never be coaxed back into making spiritual music anyway, it'd be false and you'd hear it in the sounds.

 

As a side point, "weird" reverberating sounds don't make something psychedelic! The Grateful Dead was one of the biggest psychedelic bands going in the sixties and seventies, take a listen!

[Elysium]

This one seem to be totally ignored even though I know it fit a lot of artists I know personally incl. myself.

 

Artist who seek to evolve artistically and creative seeking new grounds because they simply cant stop being curious musically.

[Rotwang]

This one seem to be totally ignored even though I know it fit a lot of artists I know personally incl. myself.

 

Artist who seek to evolve artistically and creative seeking new grounds because they simply cant stop being curious musically.

 

Sure, but it's perfectly possible for an artist to evolve into something other than generic, mainstream-sounding music. E.g. look at Kindzadza or Autechre or The Beatles or Shostakovich or...

 

[Ormion]

This one seem to be totally ignored even though I know it fit a lot of artists I know personally incl. myself.

 

Artist who seek to evolve artistically and creative seeking new grounds because they simply cant stop being curious musically.

 

The whole idea of the topic is why artist evolved their sound to the same kind of genre.

It has nothing to do with what you're saying.

 

I refuse to believe that 90% of old school artists decide to produce the same full on music because they seek to evolve artistically and creative seeking new grounds because they simply cant stop being curious musically.

[Elysium]

The whole idea of the topic is why artist evolved their sound to the same kind of genre.

It has nothing to do with what you're saying.

 

I refuse to believe that 90% of old school artists decide to produce the same full on music because they seek to evolve artistically and creative seeking new grounds because they simply cant stop being curious musically.

 

Nonsense then 99% of all the posts here are off-topic if we have to stay very strict on topic.

 

The question is why psy artists get less psy over time and one answer is that they evolve as artists and seek new creative ways also into other genres.

 

Artist X did very psychedelic music and over the years he evolved and changed his taste. Ergo he got less psychedelic as he evolved, experimented and changed his sound/genre. Simple as that.

 

I never claimed 90% got into Fullon because of that. I said many I know seeked to evolve artistically and creative seeking new grounds because they simply cant stop being curious musically. . I am one among them and I can not see myself do the same music (psychedelic or not) year after year. That would kill my creativity and musical flame. I am not the only artist I know who feel this way.

[Rotwang]

Artist X did very psychedelic music and over the years he evolved and changed his taste. Ergo he got less psychedelic as he evolved,

 

Why? It's possible to evolve without getting less psychedelic.

[Elysium]

Why? It's possible to evolve without getting less psychedelic.

 

Yes of course you can also evolve and be psychedelic. But music is so much more than just being psychedelic.

[Drosophila]

It seems obvious no single answer "clarifies" this issues, I think Basilisk had some good ideas (and the follow-ups)...

 

One thing I have noticed (not so much on my self though) is than many people when getting older seem to move away from more chaotic music, be that hyper-intense goa-trance or some darkpsy or forest trance (just to exemplify my thoughts) and into more organised music (maybe a bad term but in lack any better atm). And that in it-self could also lead to less psychedelic music.

[Rotwang]

Yes of course you can also evolve and be psychedelic. But music is so much more than just being psychedelic.

 

And music is also so much more than EDM. But the artists who start out making stuff that's very psychedelic and get less psychedelic over time almost always continue to make EDM, even staying within the confines of trance for the most part. Why do so few artists stop making EMD altogether, if they want to evolve? Saying "artists evolve" over and over again like a mantra doesn't answer the question. The question is why they evolve in a particular direction, namely in the direction of mainstream trance.