How was dark-psy born?

[Procyon]

A friend of mine was listening to Dirty South, a VA I didn't remember I had, and he liked it a lot. He asked me what was the difference between Goa and dark, and that was easy. But then when he asked HOW was dark-psy created, I had no idea whatsoever.

Any psychedelic trance expert here to explain how, where and when it was created?

[karan129]

X-Dream - Radio started the psy scene I'm told. If you have to point to a break between Goa and Psy that would be it.

[Rotwang]

I don't know much about the history, but as to how darkpsy was created, to me it's always sounded like a pretty natural progression from some of the psytrance that was around before. If you listen to an album like The Lone Deranger there are melodic elements and there are atonal noise elements; a lot of new-school Goa is what you get if you take the melodic elements, ignore the rest and build from that, whereas darkpsy is what you get if you take the atonal noise elements, ignore the rest and build from that. As to when and where it was created, I have the impression that this had a lot to do with it, though I welcome correction from someone who was there when it happened (I didn't get into psytrance until 2003, by which time Parasense were making darkpsy that could easily pass for something made in 2011).

[mars]

Xenomorph is supermelodic if you compare it to...Cosmo for example

 

IMO Parasense were the first ones 10 years ago. Few melodies, syncopated rhythmic, bizarre production (they didn't know how to work with hi-hats actually)...

 

More generally Darkpsy is an excuse for lame music creation and drug abuse (usually both).

 

A few exceptions do exist: Ocelot or Electrypnose for example know how to make music.

[IronSun]

More generally Darkpsy is an excuse for lame music creation and drug abuse (usually both).

 

 

Haha, really nice, I lol'ed.

 

But I think that's a bit too general. There's not only a few but numerous examples of dark producers who actually make intense ripping psychedelic music, I mainly think about those crazy russians, Kindzadza and Psykovsky, but for example Derango and Megalopsy make awesome stuff too. I am more of a goa trance fan, I really don't listen to dark much nor do I enjoy it that much at parties, but to say that generally dark is an excuse for lame music creation and drug abuse is stretching it a bit too far I think

[Guest nectarios]

Xenomorph is supermelodic if you compare it to...Cosmo for example

 

IMO Parasense were the first ones 10 years ago. Few melodies, syncopated rhythmic, bizarre production (they didn't know how to work with hi-hats actually)...

 

More generally Darkpsy is an excuse for lame music creation and drug abuse (usually both).

 

A few exceptions do exist: Ocelot or Electrypnose for example know how to make music.

 

X-Dream where the first ones I considered to be making psychedelic trance that is dark, both in the music and production/sound design department.

And its all about taste, I don't like neither Ocelot or Electrypnose....then again I don't like anything that I heard from the darkpsy genre....to be fair Atriohm have some good atmos in their tunes, but generally, what people call darkpsy today, is infested with the kind of FM sounds, stupid amounts of glitch, production and BPM, I do not like. It all sounds childish, dissonant and overly pretentious to me.

I listened to Tenetsveta clips on youtube....and I can not remotely relate to that kind of music...I felt like someone I was be subjected to a stupidity experiment.

Obviously some people like this stuff and that is fair enough.

 

Peace out.

[Ormion]

Darkpsy as we know it started by Parasense. Of course Parasense were influnced by older artists and X-Dream was one of them.

I also believe that darkpsy producers are the most talented artists in our scene.

[Time_Trap]

Xenomorph is supermelodic if you compare it to...Cosmo for example

 

IMO Parasense were the first ones 10 years ago. Few melodies, syncopated rhythmic, bizarre production (they didn't know how to work with hi-hats actually)...

 

More generally Darkpsy is an excuse for lame music creation and drug abuse (usually both).

 

A few exceptions do exist: Ocelot or Electrypnose for example know how to make music.

 

Well the drug use/abuse has been there since the very first start so your argument is invalid.

 

X-Dream where the first ones I considered to be making psychedelic trance that is dark, both in the music and production/sound design department.

And its all about taste, I don't like neither Ocelot or Electrypnose....then again I don't like anything that I heard from the darkpsy genre....to be fair Atriohm have some good atmos in their tunes, but generally, what people call darkpsy today, is infested with the kind of FM sounds, stupid amounts of glitch, production and BPM, I do not like. It all sounds childish, dissonant and overly pretentious to me.

I listened to Tenetsveta clips on youtube....and I can not remotely relate to that kind of music...I felt like someone I was be subjected to a stupidity experiment.

Obviously some people like this stuff and that is fair enough.

 

Peace out.

 

 

As I have said before there are some albums that are gems with high amount of psychedelia in that genre.

E.g Battle Of The Future Buddhas - Demonoizer , Psykovsky - Debut , Derango - Tumult , Para Halu - The World of Peace , Trimada - Left Behind (!!) and many more ...

[Cybernetika]

x-dream - Radio is the oldest release I would call Darkpsy (1998).

 

Then theres Xenomorph, The Delta, Tim Schuldt that come to mind. Techno and Industrial has for a longer time been very popular in Germany, so I think it was only a matter of time until one of us would choose to combine these with Psychedelic, creating a dark and cold atmosphere.

[Richpa]

In my opinion the most talented musician in darkpsy genre was Zolotarenko from Parasense. All stuff that he released under various projects was pure gold to me. Unfortunaley nowdays darkpsy tends more to higher tempos with agressive approach and in my case most important thing in dark psytrance is atmosphere. There is few projects today who are able to create such envoiorment. To be honest, I'm not following a lot darkpsy releases lately, so don't hesitate to list some interesting stuff

[Elysium]

When the dark metal scene got too scary for some kids they said "hey we can infiltrate the psy scene and worship our pentagrams and 180 bpm needs there".. and voila dark psy was invented...their leader's name was Boris from Ukraine.

[Procyon]

Now that you guys mentioned, my memory also points to Parasense as the first time I heard dark-psy. I remember I thought it was way too fast - if only I could imagine that it would get even faster, as we hear currently.

I also remember Xenomorph's "Satan", and how I got disappointed with a psytrance track with such a title. It was the first time that I had a track making open apology to satanism. I even once met Xenomorph in Isratrance and talked to

him about this fact, he simply asked me to f**k myself.

In my book, X-Dream's Radio is a mix between indutrial techno and psychedelism, never a "dark psy" album, or with elements of DP.

 

As for DP today's status, I once read that there's "laser gun battle dark psy" and "satanic dark psy", and little room between them for really good tracks.

[Time_Trap]

When the dark metal scene got too scary for some kids they said "hey we can infiltrate the psy scene and worship our pentagrams and 180 bpm needs there".. and voila dark psy was invented...their leader's name was Boris from Ukraine.

 

bullshit, a lot of dark psytrance doesn't exceed 150bmp ... Your post is provocative and ironic and does nothing more than provoking and starting a flame.

[Elysium]

bullshit, a lot of dark psytrance doesn't exceed 150bmp ... Your post is provocative and ironic and does nothing more than provoking and starting a flame.

 

 

Chill dude. It was a joke

[Time_Trap]

Ok I apologise. Bad joke though

[Elysium]

Ok I apologise. Bad joke though

 

No good one. It made you go bonkers

[Lemmiwinks]

well as always it's a question of what exactly do you consider to be THE first: trance that has dark trance elements in it that eventually became a sub-genre of its own, or the actual first dark trance track.

 

If you want the artists that defined dark trance as you hear it today, then it is Parasense. But they basically took the sound that was considered hip around their time to another level, and the sound that was considered hip around the turn of the century was X-Dream and various side-projects like The Delta, Midi Miliz, C.O.P. etc. And of course, they in turn took massive influence from the techno scene.

 

Now on the OTHER hand, since trance parties always revolved around the concept of dark tracks during the night and more melodic stuff once the sun rises, there has been dark trance since the beginning of the scene, although it was a very different dark to what we consider dark trance today. Most of that took its influences from 80s industrial. Like this for example from 1996:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6PKdws8wa8

 

and even further behind (1992):

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLl8qGNdLtM

 

hope this answers your question

[Procyon]

@ Timetrap: I think that almost all DT tracks are above 150 bpm. I think that Parasense -a snail in comparison to Psykovsky, for instance - started right there.

I may be mistaken, of course.

[Time_Trap]

@ Timetrap: I think that almost all DT tracks are above 150 bpm. I think that Parasense -a snail in comparison to Psykovsky, for instance - started right there.

I may be mistaken, of course.

 

Battle Of The Future Buddhas - Demonoizer : http://www.discogs.com/viewimages?release=61121 Max track bpm = 146

 

Psykovsky - Debut : http://www.discogs.com/Psykovsky-Debut/release/586515 max track bpm = 152 (ranging 145 -152)

 

Electrypnose - Le Tireur De Ficelles : http://www.discogs.com/Electrypnose-Le-Tireur-De-Ficelles/release/634424 bmp ranging from 148 to 151 (last track has bmp 191 but it's chillout , so you cant even distinguish the high tempo there)

 

Kinzdadza - Waves From Outer Space : http://www.discogs.com/Kindzadza-Waves-From-Outer-Space/release/229181 BMP ranging 146-149

 

 

and many more.I hope you get the picture. I think you can hardly find tracks that exceed 155 bmp, most are in the 145-155 zone.

[Rotwang]

and many more.I hope you get the picture. I think you can hardly find tracks that exceed 155 bmp, most are in the 145-155 zone.

 

While it used to be rare for darkpsy tracks to exceed 155, it's pretty common nowadays (since around 2008 I guess). The title track off Psykovsky's last album is 174, for example, and the last track off KDD's last album is 164.

[Time_Trap]

While it used to be rare for darkpsy tracks to exceed 155, it's pretty common nowadays (since around 2008 I guess). The title track off Psykovsky's last album is 174, for example, and the last track off KDD's last album is 164.

 

Yeah I think that hits the nail. I prefer the dark psytrance of 2005 more, it was more danceable for sure. New stuff is not danceable, it seems it's music I don't like to listen to very often ,and when I do so I listen to it with the same state of mind I am listening to IDM. It has become mostly braindancing ( I have in my mind Psykosky's latest ).

[pixma]

Hallucinogens Space Pussy is 156 BPM, and that track is a goa classic. The thing with BPM is just like the loudness war on records, where is it seems more impressive the louder (or faster) it goes. However, at some point the high BPM's will be subjected to inflation, where the general quality doesn't match the speed (or loudness) of the music and its not impressive anymore. It's a gift when the quality matches the BPM in music (be it high or low), and it's great to see that many are able to make great Darkpsy in 145 BPM (Pavarti Records for example). Some like it fast, some like it slow, I like it all, as long as the quality is there!

 

The new Psykovsky is very impressive, but I'm still trying to make up my mind on that album

[Elysium]

There is a musical aspect of the BPM debate where a too high BPM simply will prevent anyone from being able to let the sounds breath. Of course if that's something people like peace with it but to me as a musician I think there is a limit to the BPM terror simply because I want to be able to create sounds that breath on itself instead of a frenzy haze of noise.

[Time_Trap]

There is a musical aspect of the BPM debate where a too high BPM simply will prevent anyone from being able to let the sounds breath. Of course if that's something people like peace with it but to me as a musician I think there is a limit to the BPM terror simply because I want to be able to create sounds that breath on itself instead of a frenzy haze of noise.

 

for me the limit for a track to be danceable is 150, maximum 155 bpm but no more.

[ollylovesgoa]

People seem to be forgetting Darshan's exploration into the dark side of trance, Duck, Awakenings, Windchime etc, all classics, very dark & atmospheric, and rather old.