Procyon Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Tonight at our lounge bar the sound system is irritating everybody. Almost everyone is complaining the volume is way too loud. Which is not. What's going on is that some chill-out tracks are badly mastered, or badly written and there are these loud peaks in the middle of most musics when arpeggios, cloud or sea effects, or any other instrument (electric guitar riffs are the worst) are "highlighted" and from a relaxing mood you get instanly annoyed by the sudden loud sound. Some tracks have a 5 or 10 seconds high peak, but others last for more than 1 minute. Despite using iTunes to playback - and its built-in sound equalizer that, well, equalizes highs and lows - there are tracks that I have to correct manually, so loud they get at some points. Sorry for venting, but I hope that writters or chill-out, of any genre, are aware that instead of chilling out, some tracks just annoy-out. Last but not the least: drum and bass chill-out should be banned. Worst thing ever! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolmot Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Can you give any particular examples? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
needle ninja Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Bad mastering is everywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolmot Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Bad mastering is everywhere. The trend of calling mastering "bad" is also everywhere but it gets more complicated when people should agree, what makes it good. (Apart from tautological arguments like "it's good when it's enjoyable to listen". Well duh.) The truth is that there's no single configuration of, say, dynamics, which would fit every situation. I have some ambient/chill CDs which alter between very quiet and loud sections (a bit like good classical does). They sound excellent on headphones in a quiet room. However, when I tried them in a car with a heavy noise floor from traffic, tires etc., 90% of time I didn't hear a thing. Conversely, CDs with "ghettoblaster" mastering are good for cars and crap stereo but extremely tiring to the point of being unlistenable on headphones. There are CD series which are directly intended for commercial lounge/café use. They're extremely flat and constantly on red. The whole point is to provide a static muzak experience where every part can be heard over conversation but none exceeds it. Again, good for its purpose but awful for home listening when you could actually enjoy more dynamics. Nevertheless, CDs in general shouldn't be pressed flat. If that's what you want, get a proper DSP component for your setup. It's relatively easy to flatten dynamics during playback but next to impossible to recover them properly if the product is already compressed to hell and back, twice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procyon Posted March 20, 2013 Author Share Posted March 20, 2013 Can you give any particular examples? One of them is Snow Patrol - Chasing Cars (Mango remix), there's a guitar riff that peaks high and it's very irky. I liked your comparison to classic music - which has real loud moments, but classic music is not supposed to make you feel relaxed - as chill-out is. So, I do expect the storm moments in classic music, but not in chill-out tracks. Most times I play Ibiza chill-out, it's relaxing, but also it's the genre that has the most annoying chill-out section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veracohr Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 Tonight at our lounge bar the sound system is irritating everybody. Almost everyone is complaining the volume is way too loud. Which is not. What's going on is that some chill-out tracks are badly mastered, or badly written and there are these loud peaks in the middle of most musics when arpeggios, cloud or sea effects, or any other instrument (electric guitar riffs are the worst) are "highlighted" and from a relaxing mood you get instanly annoyed by the sudden loud sound. Some tracks have a 5 or 10 seconds high peak, but others last for more than 1 minute. Despite using iTunes to playback - and its built-in sound equalizer that, well, equalizes highs and lows - there are tracks that I have to correct manually, so loud they get at some points. Sorry for venting, but I hope that writters or chill-out, of any genre, are aware that instead of chilling out, some tracks just annoy-out. Last but not the least: drum and bass chill-out should be banned. Worst thing ever! In my experience that feature in iTunes is a complete fail, and makes things sound worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procyon Posted March 20, 2013 Author Share Posted March 20, 2013 In my experience that feature in iTunes is a complete fail, and makes things sound worse. It is not an iTunes problem. I have tested using other players and it gets the same response: some tracks have loud moments that are just written that way. Right now "Ayumi Hamasaki - Connected (Ferry Corsten remix)" is being played direct from the album and there's a moment in the track when she sings "sudeni", the "ni" part gets so loud I have learnt to turn equalize manually before someone comes complaining about the apparent high volume. It is a wonderful song, by the way. Another thing I realised it that online FMs like Di.FM and Sky.fm, when a track starts the first 5 seconds are played in a higher volume. I think it's to separate the previous track from the incoming one. Or is it just my ears? Edit: Ayumi Hamasaki's song was remixed in a chill-out style. There's a huge popular euro-trance version too. But the chill-out version is the one where her fine high-pitch voice is at its best, way too much best, according to some of my clients Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veracohr Posted March 21, 2013 Share Posted March 21, 2013 No, it's not an iTunes problem, but the automatic level shifting feature in iTunes is not a good way to try solving the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procyon Posted March 21, 2013 Author Share Posted March 21, 2013 No, it's not an iTunes problem, but the automatic level shifting feature in iTunes is not a good way to try solving the problem. I can't understand you: I have said I tested the sound system with other softwares that also have a build-in equalizer, and nothing worked. I also said that by now I know some tracks by heart and the moments when they become louder and it's patent this is because they were produced that way, and you keep insisting it's an iTunes problem?? Excuse me?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotwang Posted March 21, 2013 Share Posted March 21, 2013 No, it's not an iTunes problem [...] and you keep insisting it's an iTunes problem?? Work on your reading comprehension, Procyon. It's really bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procyon Posted March 21, 2013 Author Share Posted March 21, 2013 that feature in iTunes is a complete fail, it's not an iTunes problem but the automatic level shifting feature in iTunes is not a good way to try solving the problem. After all Vera, this feature in iTunes is a problem or not? Let'ts make this right, because I want to understand if this is an iTunes fail or not. You know, it will make the whole difference. For if you prove it's an iTunes fail, I will ask to have this thread deleted. Because then, it won't be a production problem (the loud peaks we hear in chill-out tracks), but an iTunes failure when playing the same tracks here in out lounge bar. Or it not an iTunes problem at all - it's indeed a production problem - and this thread has some reason to be kept alive. To give artists some feedback. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotwang Posted March 21, 2013 Share Posted March 21, 2013 Veracohr is not claiming that iTunes is the cause of the dynamic range problem. He is claiming that the iTunes feature in question doesn't help to solve the problem, but instead makes it worse. Can you understand that being the cause of a problem and failing to solve said problem are different things? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procyon Posted March 21, 2013 Author Share Posted March 21, 2013 Veracohr is not claiming that iTunes is the cause of the dynamic range problem. He is claiming that the iTunes feature in question doesn't help to solve the problem, but instead makes it worse. Can you understand that being the cause of a problem and failing to solve said problem are different things? My boyfriend asked me to read it all again, slowly. You both are right. I understood Vera was ponting that iTunes was the cause of the problem, not the right solution. A comment Marcius said is completely true: I read jumping words and I listen to people but I remember only part of what they said. Which is a good thing, according to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blubber Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 Last but not the least: drum and bass chill-out should be banned. Worst thing ever! ?? don't know much about this genre but maybe try bukem's journey inwards !! i think that's highly enjoyable in a lounge bar... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blubber Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 I listen to people but I remember only part of what they said. Which is a good thing, according to him. irritating view Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotwang Posted March 22, 2013 Share Posted March 22, 2013 ?? don't know much about this genre but maybe try bukem's journey inwards !! i think that's highly enjoyable in a lounge bar... For sure. Also Logical Progression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procyon Posted March 24, 2013 Author Share Posted March 24, 2013 irritating view It is irritating that you found it irritating! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
needle ninja Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 Well iTunes SUCKS, I don't go to lounges that play off iTunes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blubber Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 It is irritating that you found it irritating! really ?? so, tell me why should it be a good thing to only understand halfway what people told you ? btw, i like the surface and handiness of itunes to let look your collection like a jukebox ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Procyon Posted March 25, 2013 Author Share Posted March 25, 2013 really ?? so, tell me why should it be a good thing to only understand halfway what people told you ? btw, i like the surface and handiness of itunes to let look your collection like a jukebox ! I was trying to be humorous, that's it. I think iTunes works perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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