Guest jsb Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 Each week there's a new created label, each time it's always the same shitty formula, the same kiddy minimal musicians wanna-be artists that are copying the new "trendy-minimal-boring-repetitive-kindof-psy-trance". I'm sick of all this @!#$, i'm sick of all new 35 labels created in 2 weeks, i'm sick of all new minimal kiddys, i'm sick of this minimal music trend, can someone wake-up and starts make g00d music like we have know in the 97/98 years HEY HO, HALLUCINOGEN, ETNICA, COSMOSIS, MFG, WAKE UP jsb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jakemyth Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 20 synths at once sounds like a mess to me!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lifeform Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 well jake... you ussually dont have 20 synths going at once... you ussually have 1 or 2... and that's 1 or 2 more than minimal! haha... I hear ya jab. But there is nothing you can do about it. It's what's happening now, lets pray for some new kinda movement here... soon... please... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jakemyth Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 melodic uses 20 though.............i often wonder if music will ever b the same as it used to b. I suppose the same thing happened with hip-hop how before around 93 it was really good interesting music...then it became boring and mass produced...i sincerely hope the same doesn't happen with psy. Not saying minimal would lead to that but a drastic change in a genre usually signifies this kind of thing i do agree that something needs to go into psy before we lose it forever! perhaps us catagorising the music too much will lead to it's demise also! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest vasyachkin Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 i dislike it when sounds are made too "harmonious." This is too easy to achieve - look at commercial club trance, is that what you want? then go listen to it. to use 2 or 3 distinctly different melodies at the same time (not just harmonies of each other) is nice though. but i prefer variations that occur with time, when melody is logically changes a few times in the track, smoothly or abruptly. these variations keep the track smart interesting and exciting without making it sound too cluttered or dirty-sounding. melodic creates patterns in frequency, minimal creates patterns in time the total level of complexity is limited by your own brain, as more of one is added a little of the other must be subtracted or it will sound too confusing. Tracks like Pleiadians - Modulation are right in the middle of the spectrum. I do not favor either Minimal or Melodic or in-between stuff, if its good - its good if its not - don't listen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PuuhaMees Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 jsb I suggest u start making music yourself, u can put in just the sounds u like...and bang no need to complain anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stinky Wizard Tooth Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 I agree with Punani (how can u not?) I dont get it! Y do people complain so much? There is such a diverse selection of music out here, there and everywhere...maybe u should sit down and make yr own music. Open yr ears - Opend yr mind if that doesnt work - listen to something else...there's a lot of crap out there u will probably like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Que Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 Totally agree with Vasyachkin.. I dare say that if you take a good track considered full-on and a good track considered minimal and listen carefully, you'll find out that the minimal track uses much more different sounds and percussions than the full-on one.. they're just arranged "in time", i.e. not mixed together. What I like about this layout is that the sounds are crystal clear and the bass is REALLY deep.. Again, this is not just about any minimal track, there are minimal tracks with the same bass/drumloop going all the time, and I hate that.. that's why I don't like pure techno.. no variation.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeff Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 "if you take a good track considered full-on and a good track considered minimal and listen carefully, you'll find out that the minimal track uses much more different sounds and percussions than the full-on one." : I think you were right to use the word "considered". For my part, I'd say that a good psy trance track has lots of different sounds BY DEFINITION, and from then on, I don't care if it's in the minimal or full-on catalogue page. I don't think you can make such a general statement. Quality transcends categories. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Spiralix Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 I wanna play too! I think that its good that the music is evoling!! At the time its progressing towards the minimal directions witch is in my taste not so good! but there is alot of good minimal anyway! When i listen to an old goahead CD, there is like 5 songs that are great! the rest of it is just space fillers! its the same today! When i listened to i think it was pulse 11, yesterday in the record stor! damn! there was two tracks on disc 2 that was good at all! i think there is too much of lo quality stuff out there! Anyway, about the minimal stuff, i think its boring! He who makes the most twisted noise gets the attention! or the deepest base! music is more than pounding bass! The trance scen is like any other scen! people want to make money! so therefor they make the music that is popular! (minimal at the moment), noone that is not big enugh in the scen can afford to move on.. because you got to stay in the minimal area to get any releases... So, today you either have to be really really really good to get released, or make some minimal stuff!! -my opinin! /Mathias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Raider Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 I agree... Minimal is kinda crappy and I miss the music from 1997. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest asdf Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 Me too All 'new' cds i buy are on avg usually 4 yrs old Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 I personally have nothing against minimalistic (If it's done profesionally) but I do have something against all the unprofessional rising labels and their amature musician friends that start up each week and release crap that should never have been released outside the bedroom (as the saying goes - everybody want's to be a dj and a musician).... they drag our scene down and make it damn hard to distribute our music....why you say? Here's why: The distribution networks and shop listen to the music and decide what can be sold or what they think can be sold. If the music is something badly produced (like music produced in fruityloops ect.) and far from professional (or at least interesting) composed they will reject it. After a while when they get flooded by the semi professional music they start to think that all goa/psy sound the same and will listen to it with a negative attitude. I know there's nothing I can do about it but if we want a scene that's going ot survive the next 10 years we need to change attitude and start to act more professional... This also goes for the party promotor's...95% of them don't know the first thing about setting up a party! Basically many of the record label owners and party promoters are into the whole thing to make money to support their drug habbits! Maybe some of these people need to stay of the drugs when they work?? Of couse there are serious people making wonderful good work but they are rare! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dam10n Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 Hmm I did buy a hell of a lot of awful releases from 96-98 thinking about it.. so there has always been @!#$. The scene at the moment is I think very vibrant with top stuff come out on like demon tea and exogenic, turbotrance, boshke beats... true it ain't all classic but the psy scene seems to generate a higher quality hitrate than say house or drum n bass, where some utter utter @!#$ is coming out from all over the planet and never getting a look in. Would we rather that small labels aren't allowed to get out there? Everybody starts somewhere. And re: the shops turning down the music, well that's been going on since 1995 when I remember being able to get pretty much all the major goa releases in like HMV etc... it's a marginal form of music, which is part of its attraction, and it's always been sidelined by the shops who are bound to favour more commercial music... cos they are commercial operations. So I don't think EP is right when he says that the scene will only survive another 10 years if it gets professional because for each artist that decides to do things in a more businesslike way, a dozen new artists spring up and that friends is how dance music evolves. Isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kristian Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 I COULDN'T AGREE WITH YOU MORE JSB! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 I did not say that the artists should think more businesslike....I said that the record labels and party promoters should get their act together and start to think more professional...... Seen from a artists perspective 95% of the labels that I have released with are amatures that don't know the first thing about running a business (they don't pay royalties to the artists in time, they don't know how to promote the music, they do not know how to generetae PR) and the party promtors are just as lame.....sorry but that's the reality seen from an artists perspective..... I am sure many other artists agree. And I know that it has been like this for a long time (I have been around almost since the start) but I has indeed gone worse...... Thanks to the technology it is now very easy to make music on your computer for almost no money...that mean that many wannabe artists make music (I have nothing against them or the fact that they make music). But unfortinently many of them live in a fantasy world (maybe caused by too many drugs?) and think that they are the next BIG artists (90% try to sound like wizzy, Simon or Astral) ! Well maybe 1% of them can become BIG but it takes a lot of tallent too - not just a computer and a few tracker programs! So they make a label with a friend and start to release their fruityloop music! That is just too lame..sorry If you are one of them that feel we should stay undergroound forever...well then I am sure you won't agree with me...but if you think as I do that the more people that like the music and our scene the better - then I am sure you also agree that in ordre to attract people we need to release much more quality and less quantity! We could indeed learn a lot form the established industry when it comes to marketing and PR....not all commercialism is bad! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AutoMath Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 Jsb, i saw you dissed the new exogenic compilation "Custom File" in the reviews. I doubt you have ever listened to it, not to say that I believe you know nothing about the label and the deep avant-garde sounds of the Psychedelic Power Disco™ they provide us with. And one thing is for sure. IMHO, 1997 was definitely the worst year for psy-trance ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dam10n Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 Okay EP i like the intensity of what we're saying now so I;m gonna continue even though we aren't necessarily going to reach either (1) common ground or (2) a synthetic solution... Okay I agree that the labels are kind of unprofessional. I deal with them on the opposite side of them from you - the promo and publicity side. And the larger labels, the ones that have staff dedicated to each and every area of the label's activities, are the most professional ones. So it's kind of a vicious circle - the label starts out small and until they can hire enough people to address every business area, then they get bigger and bigger, and overnight get more professional. However some of the larger labels like tip world and 3d vision I find are the worst organised of them all! Maybe it is the drugs, but I would never begrudge them that for a second - the music is so damn good and that's why we're all here after all ) (party promoters though do need to get their act together - nobody could argue with you there...) As for the royalties not being paid on time... isn't the onus sort of on the artist as well to ensure they get their money? In business everybody is trying to shaft each other, that's what business is about - and in the industry I work in (day job, I.T.) nobody pays anybody else on time, tries to withold payments, and if somebody comes to me moaning that they haven't been paid and it turns out they didn't have an adequate contract, well it's hard not to laugh. I don't think the music should stay underground - it's way bigger now than it ever has been and the more people get into the spirit of it the better. But I think that part of that scene is picking up a dodgy self-made, terribly-produced 12" by somebody you never heard of, on a label who disappears soon after never to be heard again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Slidingtrancer Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 Psytrance just got bigger, there still alot of stuff out there thats worth it... The 95/96/97 sound started to sound generic, maybe a hybrid of minimal and pure melodic stuff will please everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 Well I see we do agree on some points dam10n but just one (long :-)) comment! When I am talking about royalties being delayed I am talking about 1-2 year delay. I am sure most businesses would have filed a lawsuit a long time before that time if it happened to them. I am not only talking about small labels but also the most respected labels in this scene! I can for example tell you that a label (one of the biggest and most respected) that I have released with used our royalty money to build their own label studio. I have managed to get my money becasuse I have hired a tough lawyer that deal with all the dodgy labels....but many artists can not afford that or they just trust the labels too much becuse they get the sense that we are all buddies! ...what a joke! I won't mention any labels here but when I tell you that around 95% of them run a dodgy business (where drugs are their main interest) it's based on my and other artists experience (I have been in meetings with some of them where they openly took drugs and smoked so much weed that they couldn't understand anything around them)....I can tell you that I just yesterday found out that yet another 2 labels has released some of my music without any license and agreement from my side! That has happened quite many times over the years! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lifeform Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 I will agree with most of you on this... Though i'm not a minimal "hater" i enjoy some of it, like bitmonx, ticon, reefer decree, and so on... but i need a melody in there! simple as that! actual notes of music. I will admit that the beats these guys come up with are nutty as hell, but is it so hard to work up a decent lead to carry you thru the song? And again... there are not 20 synths going at once in melodic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dam10n Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 heh - yeah EP that was quite a long post wasn't it... sort of got carried away well it does sound kind of bad - and this isn't the first time I've heard of this. though i think i might have a solution. could you drop me a mail to continue this thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kristian Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 TO AUTOMATH saying: -"And one thing is for sure. IMHO, 1997 was definitely the worst year for psy-trance ever." All theese absolutely incredible stunning albums were released 1997: Green Nuns Of The Revolution - Rock Bitch Mafia Hallucinogen - The Lone Deranger MFG - New Kind Of World Pleiadians - IFO Tandu - Multimoods UX - Ultimate Experience Theese albums is what I "define" as the purest trance of all music... Will there ever be such kickass stuff released again!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spiralix Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 TOATALY agree with you Kristian... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Psymijis Posted January 22, 2002 Share Posted January 22, 2002 agree with kristian but i think 2001 was a good year for psy , the problem is that a lot of people here doesn´t understand the "magic" of minimal but i have to agree that there is lot of minimal crap produced by unprofecionals (sorry dont know how to write it well) . Albums like Son kite - perspectiives of.. , planet B.E.N - silver , pure mdma 2 , vibration 4 (all are minimal ones) , prooves that 2001 was a great year for psytrance . "They can call it trance , i call it magic" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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