exotic Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 http://cultured-vultures.tumblr.com/post/137218676877/why-psytrance-hippies-are-the-absolute-worst-want He got a couple of things wrong . Still would you agree about the culture appropriation part and that the white people are trying to make up for decades of colonial oppression ? there seems to be some degree of truth IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celaripo Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 well i dont know - but about the religion - i asked my wife who is taiwanese and buddhist i asked her what she thinks about music and tracknames like buddha xxxxx and covers with buddha and in her opinion it is a bit inappropriate and disrespectful just my contribution to this thread about the rest i dunno - i am only interested in the music Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starkraver Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Posted on Richpa's fb page. you might be interested in the views expressed over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
recursion loop Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 People that mindlessly follow this or that trend or subculture are the worst lot, it has nothing to do with the music or the subculture itself. There is a Russian word "Govnari" (loosely translated as "shitheads") which denotes the very same thing but relating to Russian punk-rock and metal scene affictionados, namely to the worst part of them. These people are also known for randomly absorbing various cultural symbols, where the sources vary from orthodox gospel to Castanedas books, without giving a fvck about their actual meaning. So, it's not psytrance, it's (some part of the) people behind it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin OOOD Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 $0.02 - Apologies if this seems too hard; of course there are exceptions and you can't generalise about all psy fans or all artists or all events or all labels, but nonetheless this is a trend I've noticed, certainly over the last 10 years or so. It seems to me that psytrance fans are more prone than other people to believing in unfounded conspiracy theories such as chemtrails or "flat Earth", or to trust charlatans and con-men like Wolfe, Icke or Jones, and if this is actually true I think I might know why. As we can see from a quick glance at Facebook, committed fans of and participants in today's psytrance scene often believe that psytrance represents a vision for a way of being human that transcends our current paradigm: peace, one-ness and unity, sustainable, non-hierarchical, resource-based, innovative. However an examination of these ideas as they apply to the actual mechanics of the psy scene reveals something different: Israel, one of the major centres of the global psytrance scene and home to a disproportionate number of well-known acts is only peaceful and "in oneness" if you ignore its ingrained, systemic anti-Arab racism and apartheid resulting from the ethnic cleansing of non-Jews which accompanied its establishment and the brutal, decades-long occupation of the Palestinian territories which followed, which is supported by many (but not all) Israeli psytrance artists and promoters and at the very least ignored by those who go there to play; psy parties in remote locations often irrevocably change the character of the location and the local inhabitants (eg. Goa) and rely on unsustainable fuels and transport to occur at all, and sometimes leave an incredible mess - they are anything but sustainable, let alone carbon-neutral; the psy scene is based on a hierarchy at the top of which are a very small number of headlining acts who get the vast lion's share of remuneration and bookings whilst lower-order acts are not paid properly, if at all - that is if they even get booked (the 1% rules psytrance as it does everywhere else, and in the UK is often accompanied by pre-existing family wealth, just as in politics and industry); psytrance events and labels operate using exactly the same high-capitalist bad behaviour that we criticise everywhere else, for example the relentless spamming of release information on Facebook; the non-payment of royalties and withholding of accounting information; SUN and Ozora getting each other's Facebook pages taken down and copywriting each other's names, and Boom doing deals with Coca Cola, not to mention the exploitation of all but 1% of artists and DJs; like any other event, large psytrance events are necessarily organised to maximise ticket sales and other income in the first instance, with efficient and equitable resource use less of a priority; headlining acts often seem to use the same presets and templates leading to a homogeneity of sound and difficulty in determining who wrote a track from listening to it, and large festival lineups seem to change very little from year to year. For some people, then, being a committed psytrance fan would therefore appear to involve firmly believing that things are different to how they actually are. This wilful denial of evidence erodes one's ability to discern truth from fiction in general, and leads to a susceptibility to manipulation by false authority and charlatans of all kinds. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin OOOD Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Apologies if my post above seems too hard; of course there are exceptions and you can't generalise about all psy fans or all artists or all events or all labels, but nonetheless this is a trend I've noticed, certainly over the last 10 years or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astralprojection Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 i had backdrops of shiva and buddha when i was young, like 19 or something, but now i think it has nothing to do with the music at all, and i dont think goa, india when i hear the word goa, i just think the music. i can fully understand if a buddhist feels it is inappropriate to associate buddhism with goatrance. i also am alot more rightwing than hippies so i dont feel a relation to hippies either, although it is definetely closer than buddhism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Eye Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I've met some of the most wonderful and lovely people in the psy scene...and of course also some of the worst fucked up junkies and narcissistic assholes I'd rather forget about. The scene sure attracts all kinds of weirdos Apologies if my post above seems too hard No need to apologize. Much of the scene would need a good wake up slap in the face. And I've never even been in the innermost circles to know all that goes on behind the scenes, just an observation I've made over the years. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imba Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I am deeply annoyed by hippiez mostly... because they can't mind their own business. On parties/festivals i want to be on dancefloor, among the people, meeting plenty of them because thats reason going to parties, not just play get money and go home... but then there are always 'hippiez'. Pushing me to jump/dance even if i dont feel like i want, want to paint me with colors and powder and shit, pointless conversations, attacking me when they discover im not vegan or i dont have political interests, im not PLUR, i dont smile non stop and so on. So you come to listen and enjoy music, some cool people but it's taken from you because people dont know to control themselves. They think they are best of the world while they are ugliest and shittest thing out there imo. They all care about world and stuff, while they are constantely fucked up on drugs and doing nothing except annoying other people who actually like this music and know who is actualy playing at the moment. They say they want to live good life and have good enveiroment for their kids??? I feel sorry for their kids... lol As i never done any drug, and i am sober for 7 years these are horrible situations. Call me hater but im just being realistic. Go to parties and festivals, it's ok. And enjoy for yourself without annoying others. They are ok to bitch me for being different from them, but if i would tell them you dirty bastards need shower then im bad one here. Hows that PLUR? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oopie Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Psytrance and the culture around it is like any other genre; dependent on the social, political and environmental issues happening in the lives of people who attend these gatherings. Nowadays I feel a certain level of alienation to society and its course of action and it definitely shows when I attend a party; I'm not so eager to meet new people (although not against it either) and I think a lot of people are the same; we don't connect or find a huge interest towards each other. It has to do with decreased attention span. In general I feel people have become too obsessed in constantly see or hear something "fresh" that it conflicts with the ability to just be in the moment without expectations. Sometimes it's different, sure. Give me a forest party with a free entrance and all the artists playing for free and the odds are you might find the spirit of freedom, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starkraver Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I've met some of the most wonderful and lovely people in the psy scene...and of course also some of the worst fucked up junkies and narcissistic assholes I'd rather forget about. The scene sure attracts all kinds of weirdos What a coincidence I just said the same thing to exotic (over FB) I agree with what you have said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Eye Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 And one of the most strikingly annoying features of psytrance people is that you're actually looked down on if you don't take (a shitload of) drugs at parties. I've lost count of how many times I've got condescending looks for refusing to take drugs even if "everyone else is doing it, stop being such a pussy". Not directly said like that of course but I can read it between the lines. Seems like you're one with everyone else as long as you're as high and wasted as them. I'm in this first and foremost for the music, which unfortunately is nowadays mostly copypaste garbage for mindless partying. There are exceptions of course 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starkraver Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Lol @Imba's post. Sorry to hear that dude I was on the receiving end myself a few days ago. Out of nowhere a good friend goes completely bonkers! I just couldn't understand. The whole world is shit, you people don't know anything, I do yoga and meditation and my 3rd eye has opened. I know it all!! Abbba! It was too much. I told the girl, sorry that you feel that way , please get yourself checked and quit the so called "amazing" ac*d that you never get here or don't deserve (according to her) & thanks to her European friends she had it and a divine experience too LMAO! Come on babe! Seriously.! I genuinely felt sorry for her. I know how it is to be in that state of losing control. But she won't listen. All hail yoga babas and yoginis! Love peace and no animal cruelty and shit while the babe shits hatred and looks upon other with contemp and eats 2 pigs a goat and a couple of chickens everyday ( I don't have anything against non vegetarians) just pointing to the irony.I felt so proud after talking to her. It's good to be clean. Hi 5 AP! Yeeaa.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starkraver Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 And one of the most strikingly annoying features of psytrance people is that you're actually looked down on if you don't take (a shitload of) drugs at parties. I've lost count of how many times I've got condescending looks for refusing to take drugs even if "everyone else is doing it, stop being such a pussy". Not directly said like that of course but I can read it between the lines. Seems like you're one with everyone else as long as you're as high and wasted as them. I'm in this first and foremost for the music, which unfortunately is nowadays mostly copypaste garbage for mindless partying. There are exceptions of course Lol I have been on the receiving end of this too! He he.. Don't be scared , it's ok have it. Have it. I in my mind (scared? Lol if it was yesteryear me, there would be nothing left for you dickhead) It sure is one of the most annoying situations. And then comes the aftermath, hey don't call him for the next rave, he is a weirdo he won't do anything, he is a buzz kill. Meh! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astralprojection Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 ive noticed the elitism in "hippies" too. and i seriously frown upon that. i agree with imba regarding the annoy-factor too. i remember back when i was partying, and there was always this small group of people everywhere you went. they were ok, granted, but they were also super annoying and they felt they were above everyone else while saying the opposite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAnarchy Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I dont really understand why you all care so much about them. And why does the guy who wrote the article judge people based on their appearance and instruments they play? "There’s nothing that annoys me more than white middle class girls in bindhis. As if the complete disregard for the religious and cultural significance of the bindhi in Hindu culture isn’t enough." This attitude is just wrong. What if a guy has dreads because he simply likes them? What if a girl has a red dot on her forehead just because she likes it? And why do you associate symbols so strongly to religion and culture? Does a dot on forehead HAVE to be associated with hinduism? NOPE. It could be purely aesthetic. I dont see any of this as a disrespect to any culture. If you feel offended just by a white guy with dreads and a white girl with a bindhi, then that is your problem and you should keep it to yourself. If somebody is directly being a jerk, offending your ways, culture, religion or whatever... then that is another story. This is my opinion. Edit: As for the drug part, I agree with what Paul Eye is trying to say. The scene has become highly dependant on them and you get looked down on if you say that you are sober. I agree that this is a problem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasalom Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 http://cultured-vultures.tumblr.com/post/137218676877/why-psytrance-hippies-are-the-absolute-worst-want He got a couple of things wrong. He got nearly everything wrong. Still would you agree about the culture appropriation part and that the white people are trying to make up for decades of colonial oppression ? there seems to be some degree of truth IMO Cultural appropriation is nonsense. Human beings are free to explore and use any aspect of any human culture. We are, after all, a social animal. If cultural appropriation is wrong, than Japanese men wearing suits is wrong. After all, the suit is part of European culture. Listening to classical music by non-Europeans would also be wrong if this nonsense of cultural appropriation were something. The very idea that you are restricted in the type of sounds, foods, clothing, manners, language, and art because of the culture you came from is absurd. Let's get rid of this ridiculousness, and not worry about sharing culture. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAnarchy Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Rasalom great example. You said it better than me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astralprojection Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 i stopped reading when he said that psytrance is "goa trance's sibling". if he doesnt understand the basics then he shouldnt be speaking on it in the first place. psytrance is goa trance's MOTHER genre, and not a sibling. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Eye Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 psytrance is goa trance's MOTHER genre, and not a sibling. I think you meant it the other way. Goa trance being the mother 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasalom Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 i stopped reading when he said that psytrance is "goa trance's sibling". if he doesnt understand the basics then he shouldnt be speaking on it in the first place. psytrance is goa trance's MOTHER genre, and not a sibling. When I rip music into my computers, I label the genre on nearly all of it "Goa". If it has its origins in the Goa sound, than it's Goa to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starkraver Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 This was posted on Richpa's FB page a month ago and I had commented -- "Possibly an Om in the middle if I'm feeling cheesy that day " (Its you AP, talking about a tattoo) the extent of cultural appropriation is such that a sacred symbol/sound is cheesy now. -- This is what I have said. Of course one is free to tattoo a hundred Om's on his forehead But that sentence by AP shows how far a symbol has been used/abused. Being a Hindu(read- raised in a hindu family and surrounded by people who follow hinduism strictly) I am not sure how I feel about it. Its just weird. There was an incident reported in the news here. An angry mob of right wing guys made an Australian dude write an apology letter for having a goddess (sacred to the mob) tattooed on his leg and boasting it off. For the Aussie its just a cool exotic picture but for the mob it kinda is everything. I dont know what I'm saying. :/ If you can make any sense out of it, great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astralprojection Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 I think you meant it the other way. Goa trance being the mother actually no, psy trance is the genre, goatrance the style. thats how i always have seen it. When I rip music into my computers, I label the genre on nearly all of it "Goa". If it has its origins in the Goa sound, than it's Goa to me. thats how i feel too. i also label it and call it Goa. but i still recognize psy trance as the main genre when im being technical. just as Trance is the father of psychedelic trance. like i said, pure technicality but still, right is right.. edit: like this. All Goatrance is Psychedelic Trance. Right? But not all Psychedelic Trance is goatrance. That is a correct statement that any can agree on. So Psychedelic Trance MUST be the father/mother - otherwise that statement wouldnt make sense. It would be the other way around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astralprojection Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 This was posted on Richpa's FB page a month ago and I had commented -- "Possibly an Om in the middle if I'm feeling cheesy that day " (Its you AP, talking about a tattoo) the extent of cultural appropriation is such that a sacred symbol/sound is cheesy now. -- This is what I have said. Of course one is free to tattoo a hundred Om's on his forehead But that sentence by AP shows how far a symbol has been used/abused. Being a Hindu(read- raised in a hindu family and surrounded by people who follow hinduism strictly) I am not sure how I feel about it. Its just weird. There was an incident reported in the news here. An angry mob of right wing guys made an Australian dude write an apology letter for having a goddess (sacred to the mob) tattooed on his leg and boasting it off. For the Aussie its just a cool exotic picture but for the mob it kinda is everything. I dont know what I'm saying. :/ If you can make any sense out of it, great. the Om itself is not cheesy at all. That is not what i meant. I meant that the Om in that context, makes ME cheesy. Just to be clear The om is great, i love it still, and the meaning behind it. I felt like a buddhist most my young life. But - in the context of goatrance, for me to tatoo the om - well, that would be cheesy. IMO. just like a tatoo of shiva - would be - in the same context. If I was a buddhist or a hindu, rather, for real, ofc that symbol would not be cheesy at all. edit: can you link the facebook discussion? edit: this is actually my wallet, i had since i was 17 to 25. (1998 - 2007) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ormion Posted February 2, 2016 Share Posted February 2, 2016 Are those hippies fans of psytrance though? For me a psytrance fan is someone who cares and have a minimum knowledge about the music. I think those hippies are attracted to psytrance scene because of the whole plur thing and not because of the music. I have encountered annoying hippies in festival myself, but everytime I start talking about the music I realized they have no fucking idea about it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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