Guest ANoise Posted August 31, 2002 Share Posted August 31, 2002 Hi What do u think, is it possible to make professional music using only the PC with all these wonderfull VSTI's (ABsynth, FM7, Pentagon I and so on),Soft-Samplers and a Host like Cubase, Logic Audio, Orion Pro/Platinum? With No MIDI !!! I think it is possible, but for the mastering u need experience! Anoise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted August 31, 2002 Share Posted August 31, 2002 Yes of course it's possible....If you are refering to the post where I said it's not possible to make professional music in Reason and Fruityloops then I still stand with my words. Those programs are just to low in the sound quality. But of course it's possible to make professional sounding psy with a computer and VST's and without MIDI....It all depend on the quality of your computer, soundcard, monitors, plugins ect. But when that is said I for my case do not think it's fun to only use the computer. I like to actually play on the keys of a keyboard and play around with actual synths. Another issue is the quality of effect "machines" inside a computer and effectprocessors/machines the traditionlal way (hardware). I still belive that the computer generated effects sound too "plastic" and not at all warm wheras the "real" effectmachines are still way better. But of course I am here refering to the high - end and very costly effectmachines such as Eventide, Lexicon, Fireworx ect.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ANoise Posted August 31, 2002 Share Posted August 31, 2002 "But when that is said I for my case do not think it's fun to only use the computer. I like to actually play on the keys of a keyboard and play around with actual synths." I agree, but these actual synths cost a lot of money for amatuers. An alternative is to use a midi masterkeyboard like the evolution series, and control your vstis. thats fun too I made my contestsong: AlienNoise - 604 Maniacs with Vstis in 5 days, using Orion Pro. (that was fun ) With real synth the fun could be even better ANoise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andreas of Amygdala Posted September 1, 2002 Share Posted September 1, 2002 Eventide.... *droooooool* - God I'm drunk...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nick Posted September 1, 2002 Share Posted September 1, 2002 you can write professional music on reason. i know for a fact that there are many a tune written on reason that have been released in to the 'professional' psy trance market. each and evry way has its pros and cons - its about how you manipulate and use what you have at hand. 'a good workman never blames his tools!!!!' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted September 1, 2002 Share Posted September 1, 2002 "a good workman never blames his tools!!!!" it's got nothing to do about blaiming to do!!!!! Take a listen to Hallucinogen, KoxBox, X-dream. My own music or any other band making music without trackers and then tell me what sound best. Whatever people say I will still claim (after many years of experience in sound production) that reason is a amature tool with a very bad sound engine and echeap effects. Give me one name of a band that actually use Reason professionally and have sucess with their music.... I can't think of one. Yes you can properly find a band on some "let's have fun with our friends" label but in my book such bands and labels are not at all professional..... but merely some kids having fun......the amture way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spiralix Posted September 1, 2002 Share Posted September 1, 2002 If you are a professinal, youre a professional, that means you probably will have to invest in better synthesizers and effects processors to raise your standards.. But those who use reason only and are pleased with it, keep using it untill you get tired of it! Its the buyers who decides whats good enugh to buy.. And most buyers dont know if you use reason or pro tools. But you can never compare the quality of professional equipment and amature equipment! Thats a fact.. But its not the equipment that makes your music for you.. the skill is in the producer.. Hope this makes some sence! hehe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted September 1, 2002 Share Posted September 1, 2002 I agree spiralix but my issue is that if an artist is ok with selling his/her's music through a label that distribute through a distributor and in the end sell the music in a shop charging people a way too high price (in my mind) then the artists should be "professional" enough to bother release the music with the best sound quality as possible - and not use some cheap "low-quality" sounding software like reason or fruityloops (in most cases hacked). I think too many kids/artists laugh all the way down to the bank after they have been paid their royalities and do not bother at all to invest in proper quality studio gear. I would like to actually meet one of those so-called "professional" artists that have paied for any gear - just show me one. My morale is: If you want to seel a product then you should respect the people that buy your product and invest some money and time in a "real" studio - even if they can't tell (well most do know when they compare bands that have a good quality release over bands that don't) what you use. It all come down to respecting your "fans" and have a professional attitude toward your job! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kits Posted September 1, 2002 Share Posted September 1, 2002 Elysium, Is Rebirth the same as Reason in terms of quality? Also, what if any Soft Synths do you think are close to proffesional? What is there to look out for when persuing quality gear (soft n hard)? Kits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted September 1, 2002 Share Posted September 1, 2002 lol....Kits a huge question :-) Well you can't really compare those 2 programs since Rebirth is a simulator of TB-303 / TR-909 and not really a tracker program as Reason. I think that Rebirth is ok to use as add-on to other studio / soft gear (if you can't fin the real TB-303 / TR-909). But again I would not recommend it for solo use. I think that one of the best / professional softsynths/modulars is Absynth. It's brilliant because it's unique sounds are so differnt from anything else I have heard and it's sound processor is top-notch compared to most other softsynths. Always first figure out what you need your gear for and make sure that it's expandable (Computers, samplers ect.) or future expanding of your studio. get enough processor power and ram. 2 of my best advises are: 1: never buy a lot of gear at once...buy less and get to know it before you expand. 2. The soundcard/mixer/monitors and effect processors are 60% of the "body" of a good sound so never go on compromise with those...better to buy something of good quality and buy less synths ect......it's essential to a good quality sound production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest inkubator Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 @elysium check http://www.mida-factory.de/ for a taste of what is possible with reason. this guy works on a 266mhz pentium II, man!!! and he's releasing... maybe he would be better with cubase/logic, but who cares? peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nick Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 "give me a one name of a band that actually use reason'' I TOLD YOU that i know for a fact that there is released psy trance that was made using REASON!!! obviously you dont believe me, and i dont see why i have to list off their names just because you have a hard time admitting to yourself that producers are using reason. maybe you should buy it and give yourself some time to actually 'get to know it' instead of spending all your time twiddling lexicon effects!!! personally i dont use reason and am not trying to big it up in any way.....someone asked if you can get professional results out of it and i'm saying - YES YOU CAN!!!! i think its very harsh to dismiss any released psy trance as amateur. every producer who has got his music out there works very hard and we both know how much effort goes in to that. producers that have had released stuff deserve to be there - ok, we cant all sound as good as x-dream or hallucinogen but if we keep hanging on to that notion then psy trance is going to end up being like some kind of 'dinosaur rock' genre!!!! hallucinogen / x-dream / koxbox sound really polished, but i have heard much better written tunes than any of those acts. like i said - A GOOD WORKMAN NEVER BLAMES HIS TOOLS!!!! i haven't heard any elysium project stuff, i have'nt got any of your music - but i suppose there's a "reason" for that!!!! lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 Just one thing.....I do have Reason (1 + 2) so I know what I am talking about! Your attitude toward my music can only make me laugh out very loud. If you haven't listened to my music you can't have been in to this scene for very long..... I don't really care if you have or haven't listened to my music or if you like it or not but don't speak about things you have no clue about (I am refering to your comment about the "reason" for that) . Take a listen before you judge it - you might even learn something - I know I do when I lsten to other bands. You may think that KoxBox, Hallucinogen and X-Dream sound "polished" but mark my words my friend....they are the bands that all the other "artists" wan't to sound like and copy! Again my expereince tell me there's no way you can get a professional sound out of reason.... Even my old mother can hear the difference ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jannick Andersen Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 From what I've heard Magnetrixx use Reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kits Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 Elysium what do you think about Reaktor? Can you plz explain a bit on Absynth? If I use Reason only as a tool through Rewire like I would use Rebirth (dynamics, sequencing etc done on cubase) do i still copromise sound quality? Also, with the new FruityLoops being supported as a vsti in cubase and various improvments do you still think it has no place in proffesional productions? I plan on using a P4 with 512sdrammb ram , luna2, Cubase, Oxygen8, use Fruity, ReBirth, Reason as Tools inside Cubase ( i have also all the vst blah blah the best thing is probably a store bought Halion ) and also Wave Lab 4.... my monitors are ok and give a decent sound but they are from an unknown brand (Optimus?) and they should be upgraded... Could you make top-quality productions (soundwise) based on such a system? I have no money now for additional hardware so better monitors, mixer, synths will come in the future .... Thanks Kits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andrew Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 Hmm... Looks like another good old Elysium post. hehe... Well, If you ask me... Reason is a decent tool. I own version 1.0.1, used it for a few months and uninstalled it. (anyone want to buy it?) Reason can be used in a professional manner, but NOT as a standalone. The effects are crappy (i use waves 3.5), ReDrum is terrible (i use battery), and the sampler, well i kinda like it. It's a semi professional program that can get the job done, but not in the highest of quality. I dont like rewiring reason to SX... It eats alot of extra usage i need when i could just use something that sounds better, and it's annoying flipping back and forth between windows. Just get some hi quality VSTi's/DX's use some plugs and your already off to a better start then reason. Andrew/Lifeform Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spiralix Posted September 2, 2002 Share Posted September 2, 2002 I toataly agree with elysium in any question! HEHEH! Talamasca use reason... But that is very hearable.. they have really shitty soundquality.. and really shitty tracks.. ... (sorry talamasca)... hehe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nick Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 elysium - dont involve your mother in this - it could turn nasty!! RANT!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin OOOD Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 Avi Algranati and Ofer Dikovsky were using Reason on a G4 laptop, last time I saw them... whether they use it only for writing and not for recording/mixing I don't know though. In terms of quality, both hardware and software are capable of equal quality as its the algorithms used to perform the processing that determine quality. You put a Lexicon reveb algorithm in a VST plugin and you'll have a fucking excellent reverb inside your PC... but your PC woun't have the power for much else! The problem in my mind with Reason is that the effects and instruments are programmed to be economical with PC power rather than to be good quality (although I actually think the Reason reverb is not too shoddy, if not a patch on RVerb). Colin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 Hi Colin :-) Good to see you online mate. How's life? I know that Avi has used it for fun (recording ideas on his travels) but all the times I have been making music in his studio with him (it's quite a lot) we used Cubase/Logic and mostly hardware equipment. I won't be able to talk about Ofer but I seriously doubt that he use it professionally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lunar Man Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 I thought i can add some things here...i know that talamasca used only reactor for his CD, but he used also Monitors and a Mixer. Anyway if i am going to speak for my self: i say that Reason suxx big time if you compare it with a real synth..For example i have a Waldorf Q and it crushes all the softwaresynths together (this is how i feel)...But i must say that Rebirth is good to add a line in a track (i am talking about the 303 and not the drummachines)...i have worked with trackers and many software synths and when you have hardware stuff you feel better..you feel like you own something and the sound is soooooooo uch better... EP: what FX-boxes do you recomend? i haven't bought any yet..my mixer is a mackie 32/8, monitors Alesis m1 active, M-Audio Delta soundcard 24/96..what do you think of the other equipment?? should i update anything?? Lunar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted September 3, 2002 Share Posted September 3, 2002 Hi Lunar. It all comes down to how big your pockets are :-) but I would reccomend a box like T.C.Electronic's Fireworx. or maybe Eventide ESP?...But mind you these are not cheap boxes (The Eventide is very expensive) but they kick ass. No I don't think you should update whay you allready got. It's always nice to get a better soundcard ect. but in the end it's what's inside your head that matter. If you're happy with your equipment (which sound ok to me) and it produce a good sound then go for it. But of course you could always buy some nice synths like Clavia's Nord Modular, The Virus ect. :-)....But again be happy with what you got and get the most out of it. have a great time in your studio. pyt I pannan :-)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lunar Man Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 thanx for the tip..i have synths: waldorf Q (big version), roland Jp-8000, Doepfer Modular A-100 system (i am going sell it), roland Alpha juno, korg prophecy and a samler..i am think of a virus C and a nordlead...but i was talking about the "brain" in the studio which is the mixer, soundcard, and monitors...the monitors are good..the mixer is awesome..the thing i am thinking of is the soundcard..it is indeed a very good soundcard but i it's so cheap so i am thinking if my soundcard is good enough, .hard to explain what iam trying to say ... one more question..why is it sooo good to have like 16 in and outputs on your soundcard? I bought a very good card without all those inputs...the guy in the store said you can multirecord..but i don't mind recordning one thing and then recordning something else. and if you want 2 synths to play the same melody you can record that line and then copy it and paste it on a different channel (synth)...am i thinking correct? Lunar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elysium Project Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 It's good to have more than one in and out because it make s it possible for you to mix more individual audio channels on your hardware mixer (out) and if you're a dedicated software producer it allow you to control and mix the extern hardware synths (if you use any) internal in your computer. If you're going to make most of your music using hardware then there's no need for 16 channels in and out. I see you are pleased with your soundcard so why change it? - What you know and feel good with should always stay unless you have a need for something better or a need for externall/internal hard disk recording ect. Good luck with your music :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spiralix Posted September 4, 2002 Share Posted September 4, 2002 Lunar man! im very interested in your a-100 system!! ill send you a mail! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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